Essan:

Marcus P:

 But what is your 'science' if not that of the IPCC?  Are IPCC therefore also faith driven deniers of your version of the science?!!

 

My science is the same as that of the IPCC.  But we disagree on interpretation. 

As for cleaning up the planet, I'm reminded of something I said in my first AGW thread on TWO back in, I think, 2002 - AGW is a means to an end.  If the only way we can get humans to clean up their mess is by scarying them with catastrophic AGW, then so be it.  I'd rather we didn't have to ...... lies to children should not be needed.  But every time I see someone wantonly drop litter in the street I know that humans simply won't think of anyone or anything but themselves unless there's a very big gun, held by a very angry man, pointed at their head.

You may be a tree hugger, but you sound like a Facist and like a communist. Is that not what goverments of extremes do, tell us how to live and what to do with a gun at our heads, all for the apparent greater good. 

Personally im not interested in lies, im interested in facts and as we are seeing, there is NO run away warming. Even if there was AGW still does not fit historical facts....I am more inclined to believe the Sun, NAO and PDO shifts have a greater bearing on our climate.

This aricle has just appeared regarding PDO and NAO shifts.

http://icecap.us/images/uploads/GSA.pdf

The global warming of this century is exactly in phase with the normal climatic pattern of cyclic warming and cooling and we have now switched from a warm phase to a cool phase right at the predicted time (see graph below).

Robertski:

You may be a tree hugger, but you sound like a Facist and like a communist. Is that not what goverments of extremes do, tell us how to live and what to do with a gun at our heads, all for the apparent greater good.

I bet you were never smacked or told off as a kid and always allowed to get away with whatever you wanted.  Humans are inherently stupid.  They have to be taught how not to sh*t in their own bed.   

 

Anyway,  interesting report there because it shows exactly what I'm expecting to happen ...... with global warming continuing irrespective of natural cooling cycles.   Matches my 'heater in a room' analogy very well    Notice that the next cooling cycle after this one is predicted to produce temperatures that are still way above those of the 1990s ....

Lets take a step back, it has not happened yet ! So we dont know.

What the graph also shows is that the PDO and NAO are quite capable of increasing temperatures on there own without too much input from Anthro effects.

As for being smacked, my dad was 6'4 ex Polish forces, his father was executed by the Russians, so you make your mind up whether my father Smacked me or not !

Robertski:

Essan:

Marcus P:

 But what is your 'science' if not that of the IPCC?  Are IPCC therefore also faith driven deniers of your version of the science?!!

 

My science is the same as that of the IPCC.  But we disagree on interpretation. 

As for cleaning up the planet, I'm reminded of something I said in my first AGW thread on TWO back in, I think, 2002 - AGW is a means to an end.  If the only way we can get humans to clean up their mess is by scarying them with catastrophic AGW, then so be it.  I'd rather we didn't have to ...... lies to children should not be needed.  But every time I see someone wantonly drop litter in the street I know that humans simply won't think of anyone or anything but themselves unless there's a very big gun, held by a very angry man, pointed at their head.

You may be a tree hugger, but you sound like a Facist and like a communist. Is that not what goverments of extremes do, tell us how to live and what to do with a gun at our heads, all for the apparent greater good. 

Personally im not interested in lies, im interested in facts and as we are seeing, there is NO run away warming. Even if there was AGW still does not fit historical facts....I am more inclined to believe the Sun, NAO and PDO shifts have a greater bearing on our climate.

This aricle has just appeared regarding PDO and NAO shifts.

http://icecap.us/images/uploads/GSA.pdf

The global warming of this century is exactly in phase with the normal climatic pattern of cyclic warming and cooling and we have now switched from a warm phase to a cool phase right at the predicted time (see graph below).

 

If you look at Dr Easterbrook's graph you'll see he employers the highly advanced scientific technique of "copy 'n' paste" - he simply copys the pattern ~1945/1975  and paste it on the end of the graph.

Besides, if the net change of the PDO is zero (and it clearly is by his graph) how  come temperatures, even by Dr Easterbrook's copy 'n' paste, rise ~1.5C over two centuries? If that's a natural rate of change we'd have boiled away aeons ago...

Farenheit32:

Essan:

Marcus P:

 But what is your 'science' if not that of the IPCC?  Are IPCC therefore also faith driven deniers of your version of the science?!!

 

My science is the same as that of the IPCC.  But we disagree on interpretation. 

As for cleaning up the planet, I'm reminded of something I said in my first AGW thread on TWO back in, I think, 2002 - AGW is a means to an end.  If the only way we can get humans to clean up their mess is by scarying them with catastrophic AGW, then so be it. I'd rather we didn't have to  ...... lies to children should not be needed.  But every time I see someone wantonly drop litter in the street I know that humans simply won't think of anyone or anything but themselves unless there's a very big gun, held by a very angry man, pointed at their head.

 

What a supremely arrogant statement, but then no account people who quote themselves are usually supremely arrogant beings. "I'd rather we didn't have to" Who the hell are you to have to tell people how to conduct themselves?

Yes this seems to be the case with some of the alarmist who seem to think they have the right to play god, and preach to the rest of us  about how we should choose to live our lives!

Solar Cycles:

Farenheit32:

Essan:

Marcus P:

 But what is your 'science' if not that of the IPCC?  Are IPCC therefore also faith driven deniers of your version of the science?!!

 

My science is the same as that of the IPCC.  But we disagree on interpretation. 

As for cleaning up the planet, I'm reminded of something I said in my first AGW thread on TWO back in, I think, 2002 - AGW is a means to an end.  If the only way we can get humans to clean up their mess is by scarying them with catastrophic AGW, then so be it. I'd rather we didn't have to  ...... lies to children should not be needed.  But every time I see someone wantonly drop litter in the street I know that humans simply won't think of anyone or anything but themselves unless there's a very big gun, held by a very angry man, pointed at their head.

 

What a supremely arrogant statement, but then no account people who quote themselves are usually supremely arrogant beings. "I'd rather we didn't have to" Who the hell are you to have to tell people how to conduct themselves?

Yes this seems to be the case with some of the alarmist who seem to think they have the right to play god, and preach to the rest of us  about how we should choose to live our lives!

 

Or indeed complacent and ignorant (since we're slinging such terms about) people who think they can play god, by doing what they like to the atmosphere (and planet), and thus choose how my planet and my climate is against my will, and then they pontificate on about climate science as if they were the experts .

 

Solar Cycles:

Farenheit32:

Essan:

Marcus P:

 But what is your 'science' if not that of the IPCC?  Are IPCC therefore also faith driven deniers of your version of the science?!!

 

My science is the same as that of the IPCC.  But we disagree on interpretation. 

As for cleaning up the planet, I'm reminded of something I said in my first AGW thread on TWO back in, I think, 2002 - AGW is a means to an end.  If the only way we can get humans to clean up their mess is by scarying them with catastrophic AGW, then so be it. I'd rather we didn't have to  ...... lies to children should not be needed.  But every time I see someone wantonly drop litter in the street I know that humans simply won't think of anyone or anything but themselves unless there's a very big gun, held by a very angry man, pointed at their head.

 

What a supremely arrogant statement, but then no account people who quote themselves are usually supremely arrogant beings. "I'd rather we didn't have to" Who the hell are you to have to tell people how to conduct themselves?

Yes this seems to be the case with some of the alarmist who seem to think they have the right to play god, and preach to the rest of us  about how we should choose to live our lives!

Indeed.  We tell you not to play with knives.  Not to play with matches.  Not to poke that stick in your sister's eye.  But will you listen?   Now you lie there bleeding, the house is in flames and your sister cannot see.     Were we wrong to try? 

Devonian:

If you look at Dr Easterbrook's graph you'll see he employers the highly advanced scientific technique of "copy 'n' paste" - he simply copys the pattern ~1945/1975  and paste it on the end of the graph.

Besides, if the net change of the PDO is zero (and it clearly is by his graph) how  come temperatures, even by Dr Easterbrook's copy 'n' paste, rise ~1.5C over two centuries? If that's a natural rate of change we'd have boiled away aeons ago...

 

Good points there.  And now look through the paper I see Easterbrook hasn't made a scientific projection at all and doesn't even explain why he shows global warming continuing unabated.  I suppose I should know better than to assume a professor of geology knows what he's talking about! The paper just seems to be ill informed opinion and shows no greater understanding of the subject than you expect of anyone else of average intelligence.

The full 'paper' such as it is can be read here:

http://www.ac.wwu.edu/~dbunny/research/global/214.pdf

Devonian:

Solar Cycles:

Farenheit32:

Essan:

Marcus P:

 But what is your 'science' if not that of the IPCC?  Are IPCC therefore also faith driven deniers of your version of the science?!!

 

My science is the same as that of the IPCC.  But we disagree on interpretation. 

As for cleaning up the planet, I'm reminded of something I said in my first AGW thread on TWO back in, I think, 2002 - AGW is a means to an end.  If the only way we can get humans to clean up their mess is by scarying them with catastrophic AGW, then so be it. I'd rather we didn't have to  ...... lies to children should not be needed.  But every time I see someone wantonly drop litter in the street I know that humans simply won't think of anyone or anything but themselves unless there's a very big gun, held by a very angry man, pointed at their head.

 

What a supremely arrogant statement, but then no account people who quote themselves are usually supremely arrogant beings. "I'd rather we didn't have to" Who the hell are you to have to tell people how to conduct themselves?

Yes this seems to be the case with some of the alarmist who seem to think they have the right to play god, and preach to the rest of us  about how we should choose to live our lives!

 

Or indeed complacent and ignorant (since we're slinging such terms about) people who think they can play god, by doing what they like to the atmosphere (and planet), and thus choose how my planet and my climate is against my will, and then they pontificate on about climate science as if they were the experts .

 

Complacency is when we say that the science is settled, when the facts say otherwise! And ignorance is when we choose to ignore the facts!

Essan:

Devonian:

If you look at Dr Easterbrook's graph you'll see he employers the highly advanced scientific technique of "copy 'n' paste" - he simply copys the pattern ~1945/1975  and paste it on the end of the graph.

Besides, if the net change of the PDO is zero (and it clearly is by his graph) how  come temperatures, even by Dr Easterbrook's copy 'n' paste, rise ~1.5C over two centuries? If that's a natural rate of change we'd have boiled away aeons ago...

 

Good points there.  And now look through the paper I see Easterbrook hasn't made a scientific projection at all and doesn't even explain why he shows global warming continuing unabated.  I suppose I should know better than to assume a professor of geology knows what he's talking about! The paper just seems to be ill informed opinion and shows no greater understanding of the subject than you expect of anyone else of average intelligence.

The full 'paper' such as it is can be read here:

http://www.ac.wwu.edu/~dbunny/research/global/214.pdf

 

This is the heart of the matter really. I'm going to ignore the bizarre mudslinging going on in this thread.

The graph in question should really be labelled 'cool, warmer, steady, warmer, steady, warmer....'

It is possible that this is the kind of thing we are going to see as natural cycles are transposed onto a rather more constant global warming signal. 

Iceman:

Ulric, this is a blatant ad hom.

 

Nope, it's a perfectly reasonable observation that a persons position on an issue depends on their world view. Opinions are subjective.

Snock:

The graph in question should really be labelled 'cool, warmer, steady, warmer, steady, warmer....'

It is possible that this is the kind of thing we are going to see as natural cycles are transposed onto a rather more constant global warming signal. 

 

That's what I think, hence I was excited about this paper until I actually read it ..... however I still think the pattern shown will prove correct, even if the rational behind it is not.  Obviously I may be wrong.