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Charmhills
06 October 2014 16:20:28


Just to add a little balance, the above is really grasping at straws for some reason. The outlook looks overwhelmingly unsettled and rather average for the time of year. Well it is early October...


Originally Posted by: Matty H 


Indeed.


Loughborough, EM.

Knowledge is power, ignorance is weakness.

Duane.
Quantum
06 October 2014 16:30:51

That 12Z was bloody close, but the icelandic ridge moved just to far south and too quickly; again this is well within the range where this can be modified to a perfect scenario. This one had the -5C 850hpa isotherm in the northern isles (but note that it won't be cold enough for wintry precipitation as cold air not making it far south enough at lower levels, steep lapse rate means heavy showers though).


The arctic air-mass is sitting at roughly the altitude of the fareo islands at its most southern point here:



The issue is high pressure breaking away from greenland, the trough of low pressure in the E greenland sea is expected as the greenland high is obviously going to maintain its integrity. 


Note also how extremely cold air moves into the atlantic arctic in the short term, the -20C 850hpa isotherm over svalbard wouldn't look out of place in a cold snap in mid january. The later details can always change, so this is something that it isn't unreasonable to spark the interest of, even if the chance that all these factors come together at once to create the perfect synotpics are very unlikely.  


 


2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
Matty H
  • Matty H
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
06 October 2014 18:16:35

Was just pointing out so that people didn't get the wrong idea, Q. I'll be doing that a lot this winter as I've never seen you post anything but any cold chart you can ever find no matter how utterly zonal the outlook. Always good to have an accurate reflection of the models rather than cherry picking I think 


 


On the plus side we have Gibby, James, Gavin and several others to give us the real picture, so it's also good to have some more light-hearted, more "fun" kind of interpretations. Looking forward to Richard in Aberdeens' rants. Lol. 


Frostbite80
06 October 2014 18:36:28


Was just pointing out so that people didn't get the wrong idea, Q. I'll be doing that a lot this winter as I've never seen you post anything but any cold chart you can ever find no matter how utterly zonal the outlook. Always good to have an accurate reflection of the models rather than cherry picking I think 


 


On the plus side we have Gibby, James, Gavin and several others to give us the real picture, so it's also good to have some more light-hearted, more "fun" kind of interpretations. Looking forward to Richard in Aberdeens' rants. Lol. 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 

harsh matty Q always posts by backing thoughts even if it is a long shot and is a valued contributor IMO as well as the other members you mention

Quantum
06 October 2014 18:36:29


Was just pointing out so that people didn't get the wrong idea, Q. I'll be doing that a lot this winter as I've never seen you post anything but any cold chart you can ever find no matter how utterly zonal the outlook. Always good to have an accurate reflection of the models rather than cherry picking I think 


 


On the plus side we have Gibby, James, Gavin and several others to give us the real picture, so it's also good to have some more light-hearted, more "fun" kind of interpretations. Looking forward to Richard in Aberdeens' rants. Lol. 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 


Perhaps not a zonal chart, but I have predicted zonal conditions many times before on TWO, sometimes even when other people are predicting cold. But I just can't get as enthusiastic about those posts. I'll make sure to caveat all my posts so that guests understand how they should be interpreted; I think you know that I am not really the James Madden type, but merely have interests that lie here. I agree there is a degree of cherry picking here, but I am doing my best to present the charts objectively and in a completely unbiased way. I probably could give a more rounded picture but honestly it would just bore me to tears, and nothing I am saying is wrong or even misleading, its just a focus rather than a big picture view (I guess like being interested in UK affairs rather than international affairs).


Like I say, odds on this becoming an actual cold spell about 1/8. And even if it did materialize people would wonder what the fuss was all about; but I find anything that even approaches record or at least 'out of place' weather fascinating which is why Agni is my favorite tropical cyclone.


Anyway I get your point and will continue to enphasise that this is potential rather than a forecast that is likely to happen. But if people treat these posts appropriately then they should not mislead and will be accurate as realistically possible. 


2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
Quantum
06 October 2014 18:45:46

On that note the ECM is very bad news for my cold spell. The pattern on this run has shifted massively east, this happens all too often. We can see that the -10C 850hpa isotherm barely coveres svalbard where we had -20C on the 12Z GFS. The cold shot is dissapearing to Finland and West Russia.



Nothing really matters after this chart because there is no chance for recovery even if a direct northerly materializes. I am a little surprised that the short term pattern in the arctic was disrupted so early on, it shows there is still alot of uncertainty. The ECM0Z had the cold shot further west than the GFS, now it has it 2000kms further east by 144h. 


2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
Polar Low
06 October 2014 18:48:52

Indeed Frostbite I agree cant let Matty have it his own way all the time


close from ukmo t144


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/ukmo2.php?nh=1&ech=144&carte=1021


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/ukmo2.php?nh=1&ech=144&carte=1007


has done well at t144 ukmo


http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS/html/new_acz6.html


winter is coming :yahoo: 


quote=Frostbite80;635770]



Was just pointing out so that people didn't get the wrong idea, Q. I'll be doing that a lot this winter as I've never seen you post anything but any cold chart you can ever find no matter how utterly zonal the outlook. Always good to have an accurate reflection of the models rather than cherry picking I think 


 


On the plus side we have Gibby, James, Gavin and several others to give us the real picture, so it's also good to have some more light-hearted, more "fun" kind of interpretations. Looking forward to Richard in Aberdeens' rants. Lol. 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 

harsh matty Q always posts by backing thoughts even if it is a long shot and is a valued contributor IMO as well as the other members you mention


snow 2004
06 October 2014 19:02:54



Was just pointing out so that people didn't get the wrong idea, Q. I'll be doing that a lot this winter as I've never seen you post anything but any cold chart you can ever find no matter how utterly zonal the outlook. Always good to have an accurate reflection of the models rather than cherry picking I think 


 


On the plus side we have Gibby, James, Gavin and several others to give us the real picture, so it's also good to have some more light-hearted, more "fun" kind of interpretations. Looking forward to Richard in Aberdeens' rants. Lol. 


Originally Posted by: Quantum 


Perhaps not a zonal chart, but I have predicted zonal conditions many times before on TWO, sometimes even when other people are predicting cold. But I just can't get as enthusiastic about those posts. I'll make sure to caveat all my posts so that guests understand how they should be interpreted; I think you know that I am not really the James Madden type, but merely have interests that lie here. I agree there is a degree of cherry picking here, but I am doing my best to present the charts objectively and in a completely unbiased way. I probably could give a more rounded picture but honestly it would just bore me to tears, and nothing I am saying is wrong or even misleading, its just a focus rather than a big picture view (I guess like being interested in UK affairs rather than international affairs).


Like I say, odds on this becoming an actual cold spell about 1/8. And even if it did materialize people would wonder what the fuss was all about; but I find anything that even approaches record or at least 'out of place' weather fascinating which is why Agni is my favorite tropical cyclone.


Anyway I get your point and will continue to enphasise that this is potential rather than a forecast that is likely to happen. But if people treat these posts appropriately then they should not mislead and will be accurate as realistically possible. 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 


 


Q, your posts read loud and clear to myself and probably many others.


Yes, the charts/discussions are often cold biased ,but they are always very clear in explaining that they are not for certain and many things need to come together for it to happen etc.


Combined with the other knowledgeable posters that provide a more general focus it all makes good for very good reading on this forum. I don't think there needs to be a disclaimer post every time Q posts an analysis.


 


 


Glossop Derbyshire, 200m asl
Matty H
  • Matty H
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
06 October 2014 19:32:52


Indeed Frostbite I agree cant let Matty have it his own way all the time


close from ukmo t144


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/ukmo2.php?nh=1&ech=144&carte=1021


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/ukmo2.php?nh=1&ech=144&carte=1007


has done well at t144 ukmo


http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS/html/new_acz6.html


winter is coming :yahoo: 


quote=Frostbite80;635770]



Was just pointing out so that people didn't get the wrong idea, Q. I'll be doing that a lot this winter as I've never seen you post anything but any cold chart you can ever find no matter how utterly zonal the outlook. Always good to have an accurate reflection of the models rather than cherry picking I think 


 


On the plus side we have Gibby, James, Gavin and several others to give us the real picture, so it's also good to have some more light-hearted, more "fun" kind of interpretations. Looking forward to Richard in Aberdeens' rants. Lol. 


Originally Posted by: Polar Low 

harsh matty Q always posts by backing thoughts even if it is a long shot and is a valued contributor IMO as well as the other members you mention


Originally Posted by: Matty H 



youve totally misinterpreted me. I didn't say he wasn't a valued contributor. Yes he does post long posts and back them up, but I'm regularly baffled as to why one would spend twenty mins posting a long diagnosis of a total outlier, something he does regularly. That's not to say he shouldn't, I'm not saying don't do it, it just seems a little odd. If it was cold and someone was doing the same with mild charts they'd be called a troll, and no I'm not saying he is, I'm just pointing out how things can be misinterpreted.


For the record - carry on, Q. More power to your elbow. 


Osprey
06 October 2014 20:04:40
got to say i do get worried when Q posts cos one day he will be right! only joking Q 😉
Nobody likes a smartass, especially another smartass...
If it ain't broke, don't fix it!
GIBBY
07 October 2014 07:30:58

HERE IS MY LATEST ANALYSIS FROM THE OUTPUTS OF THE WEATHER COMPUTER PREDICTION MODELS FOR TWO WEEKS FROM 8AM TODAY TUESDAY OCTOBER 7TH 2014.


NEXT UPDATE WEDNESDAY OCTOBER 8TH 08:00


THE CURRENT GENERAL SITUATION. An unstable West or SW flow covers the UK with a deep Low approaching Western Britain tomorrow.


MODELS-2 WEEK HEADLINE  All areas look like being unsettled and windy with rain at times in cool conditions. Possibly becoming dry and quieter across the UK later.


THE JET STREAM ENSEMBLE FORECAST The Jet Stream currently lying across Northern France continues to be maintained to the South of the UK for the next 5-7 days. It then shows signs of disrupting somewhat and splitting with a Northern arm becoming the dominant part andheading to a position North of the UK in week 2 while a much weaker Southern arm lies across North Africa at the end of the run.


GFS The GFS operational today offers two distinctly different weeks of weather to come with week 1 dominated by a deep low moving slowly NE over Ireland over the next 48 hours to lie as a slow moving feature close to Northern Scotland and filling slowly by the coming weekend. Pressure then gently rises from the SE as a mild SW flow develops for a time with some more rain in the North and West. By midweek pressure has risen strongly everywhere with a large Autumn anticyclone lying over the UK later next week with fine days and mist and fog at night and morning for many. A SE flow then develops across the South to end the run but dry weather would probably prevail.


THE GFS ENSEMBLES. The GFS Ensembles are very supportive of it's operational this morning even in the further reaches of the run with a large UK based High pressure returning fine conditions for all by midway through Week 2 possiby with extensive overnight and morning mists and fogs in the very light winds.


UKMO UKMO this morning shows our deep Low currently moving NE over the coming days over Ireland and Scotland to lie as a slow moving and filling feature near Northern Scotland at the start of next week. Winds will fall light but the weak Westerly airflow will remain unstable and very supportive of further heavy showers or outbreaks of rain in places across the UK.


THE FAX CHARTS  The Fax Charts show Low pressure to the West and SW with a complex array of troughs gradually transferring NE over the coming 4-5 days with the main centre lying close to the far North at the weekend as a much weaker feature as pressure rises slowly from the South.


GEM The GEM operational today is dismissive of the GFS sequence of events as it goes the other way next week in suggesting a gradual return to deep UK based Low pressure with wind, rain and showers in abundance for all after a brief lull at the weekend.


NAVGEM NAVGEM does look a little more like GFS as it shows a gentle rise of pressure from the South next week as deep Low pressure slips deeper into the Atlantic and lies further Wet away from us pushing a milder SW flow up across the UK next week with rain probably more rstricted towards the North and West with time as higher pressure lies to the SE. 


ECM The ECM operational shows a more integrated push towards the UK of deep Atlantic Low pressure next week with a deep centre lying not far to the NW of Ireland by midweek next week with a strong SW flow carrying troughs NE across the UK with wind and rain for all in temperatures recovering somewhat from current levels.


NOTABLE TREND CHANGES FROM PREVIOUS RUNS GFS and to a lesser degree NAVGEM have turned more towards High pressure based weather pattern commencing next week but as yet this is not supported by the other output.


MY THOUGHTS  Some interesting switches in output this morning mostly from the American viewpoint as GFS has gone all out in switching from an unsettled and windy period next week to High pressure sat across the UK bringing fine and potentially foggy weather night and morning with quiet and bright days. It is well supported within it's own ensembles but less so from the other output. While the theory that leads to this happening is shown by other models too their thoughts gear towards the Atlantic being much stronger through week 2 than GFS shows with the net result that the milder and High pressure based surge shown is much more muted and while the South and East might benefit from less rain than elsewhere with warmer winds from the SW the North and West will probably see quite a bit of wind and rain as High pressure shown by most other European and the Canadian model output remains over the continental side of Europe. We must not discount the possibility of the output of GFS verifying especially since it has support from it's own ensemble pack but until this extends in a greater way to the other models it is subject to change over the coming runs and days. So my own thoughts this morning are to go with the majority this morning in saying that it looks like there will be more wind and rain next week following that of this week and although the emphasis of this will probably shift more towards the North and West if the GEM theory is right we will all be under attack from gales or in places severe gales and heavy rain later next week. However, I think that the ECM version this morning may be nearer the mark come the time.


Martin G
Kilmersdon Radstock Bath Somerset



Look up my New Facebook Weather Page  for all the latest up to the minute weather stories as they happen
idj20
07 October 2014 07:40:03

Hope the low-res end of the GFS output does actually ring true, Gibby, and we go onto having a quiet settled second half to October after all. I'm already sick of the wind and rain and that's only after barely two days of it.  

EDIT at 11.15 am: This particular model is still trending with that high pressure orientated theme in it's latest run - and that's usually the worst of the four runs of the day (often has that "got out of the wrong side of the bed" look about it). Now if that could all slip into the hi-res time frame then it would be lovely. The more of Autumn gets eaten up by such a set up, the better.


Folkestone Harbour. 
Polar Low
07 October 2014 07:55:23

Thanks Martin,


Out of interest stunning winter set up gm opp at day 10 full of promise with the pv to our n/e with slumping jet would just need a tiny bit of luck if that was in the depth of winter.


 


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/geme_cartes.php?&ech=240&mode=0&carte=1


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/geme_cartes.php?&ech=240&mode=5&carte=1

bledur
07 October 2014 08:13:49

           Forecasters Lament.


 


           And now among the fading embers


            These in the main are my regrets


           When i am right no one remembers


           When i am wrong no one forgets


  Anon

Saint Snow
07 October 2014 08:32:59



Indeed Frostbite I agree cant let Matty have it his own way all the time


close from ukmo t144


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/ukmo2.php?nh=1&ech=144&carte=1021


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/ukmo2.php?nh=1&ech=144&carte=1007


has done well at t144 ukmo


http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS/html/new_acz6.html


winter is coming :yahoo: 


[quote=Frostbite80;635770]



Was just pointing out so that people didn't get the wrong idea, Q. I'll be doing that a lot this winter as I've never seen you post anything but any cold chart you can ever find no matter how utterly zonal the outlook. Always good to have an accurate reflection of the models rather than cherry picking I think 


 


On the plus side we have Gibby, James, Gavin and several others to give us the real picture, so it's also good to have some more light-hearted, more "fun" kind of interpretations. Looking forward to Richard in Aberdeens' rants. Lol. 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 


harsh matty Q always posts by backing thoughts even if it is a long shot and is a valued contributor IMO as well as the other members you mention


Originally Posted by: Polar Low 


 


youve totally misinterpreted me. I didn't say he wasn't a valued contributor. Yes he does post long posts and back them up, but I'm regularly baffled as to why one would spend twenty mins posting a long diagnosis of a total outlier, something he does regularly. That's not to say he shouldn't, I'm not saying don't do it, it just seems a little odd. If it was cold and someone was doing the same with mild charts they'd be called a troll, and no I'm not saying he is, I'm just pointing out how things can be misinterpreted.


For the record - carry on, Q. More power to your elbow. 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 


 


Making friends again I see, Matthew?


 


 




Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
Matty H
  • Matty H
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
07 October 2014 10:44:34

Making friends online is for people that don't actually have any really friends 


Stormchaser
07 October 2014 10:51:09

No chart available for the selected hour. Many charts start at 3 hours ahead, so if you have 0 hours selected try stepping forward or selecting a later hour.  No chart available for the selected hour. Many charts start at 3 hours ahead, so if you have 0 hours selected try stepping forward or selecting a later hour.


A glance at the day 5 output from GFS (left) and ECM (right) shows a very slack setup with light winds and some showers around. Temperatures could climb reasonably high during the daytime, probably mid to high teens, but may be rather low overnight where skies clear.


No chart available for the selected hour. Many charts start at 3 hours ahead, so if you have 0 hours selected try stepping forward or selecting a later hour.  No chart available for the selected hour. Many charts start at 3 hours ahead, so if you have 0 hours selected try stepping forward or selecting a later hour.


Longer term, there remains a consistent trend towards an Atlantic low digging south out west while a ridge builds through Europe - warming up but remaining unsettled for the NW in particular. ECM takes two days longer than GFS to bring the tropical maritime air to our shores, due in part to a bit of development occurring within the slack low pressure seen in the earlier two charts and tracking NNE to Norway and beyond.


If you have any problems or queries relating to TWO you can Email [email protected]

https://twitter.com/peacockreports 
2023's Homeland Extremes:
T-Max: 30.2°C 9th Sep (...!) | T-Min: -7.1°C 22nd & 23rd Jan | Wettest Day: 25.9mm 2nd Nov | Ice Days: 1 (2nd Dec -1.3°C in freezing fog)
Keep Calm and Forecast On
Quantum
07 October 2014 11:58:00

I think the possibility of my cold spell has all but dissapeared. Unfortunately there was a shift in the short term synoptics just before the reliable timeframe; I thought the chance that the original cold shot from the arctic (to svalbard) would be in the right place was high, and it was the position of the trough that would be the 'king maker' so to speak. However this has not happened, instead last night the models underwent a very dramatic switch; incidentally ECM I am not impressed with you, you shifted by more than 2000kms. Now a synoptic change is required at 96h:


 


Netweather GFS Image


which is extremely unlikely. I have seen dramatic corrections at this stage but they have never been in favor of a cold spell; I'm still waiting for an example where this has happened. On the bright side the longwave pattern is pretty good; perhaps there will be another opportunity at the end of October before the train of depressions really set in.


2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
Gavin P
07 October 2014 12:58:53

Hi all,


Here's my latest video update:


High Pressure Coming Back For Second Half Of October?


http://www.gavsweathervids.com


Might be sign's of another change. Early day's though yet.


Rural West Northants 120m asl
Short, medium and long range weather forecast videos @ https://www.youtube.com/user/GavsWeatherVids
Tractor Boy
07 October 2014 16:00:29


High Pressure Coming Back For Second Half Of October?


Originally Posted by: Gavin P 


 


Like this.


 


Ok, I'm going...


Dave
Farndale, North York Moors
Osprey
07 October 2014 18:43:53



High Pressure Coming Back For Second Half Of October?


Originally Posted by: Tractor Boy 


 


Like this.


 


Ok, I'm going...


Originally Posted by: Gavin P 


Yes bring it on! Back out with the BBQ


Nobody likes a smartass, especially another smartass...
If it ain't broke, don't fix it!
Notty
07 October 2014 18:56:17



High Pressure Coming Back For Second Half Of October?


Originally Posted by: Tractor Boy 


 


Like this.


 


Ok, I'm going...


Originally Posted by: Gavin P 


22/10/1962 - the day before I was born and what a lovely winter that was 😃


Notty
Pontypool, 132m asl
Polar Low
07 October 2014 19:04:11

yup warm for october in southern parts after a day or two on the 12z gfs run mean gets pushed up with support


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/MT8_London_ens.png


gentle rise of pressure from the east or s/e


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/MT2_London_ens.png


 http://mp1.met.psu.edu/~fxg1/ECMWF_0z/hgtcomp.html


warm for mid to late october for most southern parts.


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/royaume-uni/temperatures-2m/168h.htm


 





High Pressure Coming Back For Second Half Of October?


Originally Posted by: Osprey 


 


Like this.


 


Ok, I'm going...


Originally Posted by: Tractor Boy 


Yes bring it on! Back out with the BBQ


Originally Posted by: Gavin P 

Quantum
07 October 2014 19:42:38

Netweather GFS Image


Recurring theme of high pressure close to the UK. I'd be interested to know the earliest possible cold snap on a continental flow, in spring its just about possible in mid April (2013 was close to the extreme here)*  which would imply based on the lag that wintry weather is impossible on a continental flow until at the extreme earliest the last week of October or the first week of November; I'm not sure if this has ever happened though. So given this for the month of October we need to be watching for northerlies and only northerlies to produce wintry weather. Anyway back to discussion, from a cold weather enthusiasts viewpoint there is little value in blocked weather at the moment therefore, I know some people try to link it to '62 or whatever, but pattern matching is unreliable at best. That said it is not too early for some cold pooling over Scandinavia which could make cold uppers easier to access later and in many ways better than a colder northerly plunge which despite being colder for Scandinavia would easily be swept away. Continuous high pressure for a long time would cool down Scandinavia and E Europe a lot, and hopefully the original cold shot might provide some snow cover. 


*It is possible from looking at historical data that its actually late April based on a single instance; I will try and find a citation. The reason for using spring data to work this out is that its much easier to get close to the 'extreme' in Spring because the Atlantic is at its weakest so there are far more opportunities to tap into cold air, whereas we would expect in Autumn conceivable snow events on a northerly could happen earlier than ever seen before due to a freak circumstance (For a northerly earliest possible snow ~ Late September, for an Easterly ~ Late October.)


2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.

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