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Medlock Vale Weather
30 December 2014 22:13:29

Well Mr Fergusson still says that there is a chance of a pattern change but not till towards the end of January. Before then he says we have some stormy weather to put up with, suppose it's more interesting than a boring bartlett slug.


Alan in Medlock Valley - Oldham's frost hollow. 103 metres above sea level.
What is a frost hollow? http://www.weatheronline.co.uk/reports/wxfacts/Frost-hollow.htm 
Saint Snow
31 December 2014 11:04:55

Out of curiosity, could someone answer me a little ponderance that popped into my head:


There is talk that good snow cover over Siberia & Scandinavia encourages the formation of high pressure there, connected to the cold airmass above being more stable (have I got this right?)


If that's the case, when then does the theory not work equally across Eastern Canada & Greenland?



Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
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Matty H
31 December 2014 11:10:38


Well Mr Fergusson still says that there is a chance of a pattern change but not till towards the end of January. Before then he says we have some stormy weather to put up with, suppose it's more interesting than a boring bartlett slug.


Originally Posted by: Medlock Vale Weather 


Well there's always a chance of pattern change. You can say that any day of the year and it's accurate. 


In the meantime it looks rather tedious, albeit at least it's not cold. I do realise I leave myself open here to Gooner posting a line of numbers and telling me it's not beach weather like it usually is in January 


Whether Idle
01 January 2015 08:15:48

Happy New Year  to all TWOers!


Ive done a bit of "karten arkive" trawling and the early 1970s winters bear some resemblance to this year, but as so much has changed in the intervening 40 years I'm less well disposed to pattern matching than I once was.


Looking at things another way, there are about 13 weeks between the solstice and the spring equinox.  We are 1 and a half weeks through that 13 week period.  There remain about 11 and a half weeks of winter weather opportunity for severe conditions (March 2013 was a wake up call for many as to just what March can deliver in this respect).


The next 2 weeks are a zonal write off to my eyes, that then leaves us 9 and a half weeks til the equinox.  My view remains that February this year will offer the best opportunity for some widespread lowland snow. Edit - I'm starting see 1983 as a best fit analogue FWIW.


Its going to be another fascinating period of model watching, Im hopeful that a close by Azores high or even Bartlett High over the next couple of weeks can spare me the same battering from gales that I had last winter, as it is looking potentially quite violent, 8-11 January on all the models looks nasty.


Dover, 5m asl. Half a mile from the south coast.
Gray-Wolf
01 January 2015 15:17:15

So with near record global temps (due to hot oceans) and DMI80N showing low Arctic temps would that hint at more energy in the weather machine as it fights to even things out?


Until the Arctic is ice free over winter ( and shrouded in fog keeping it warm over the sunless months) a warming planet must surely spawn energetic weather as the difference, pole to equator, increases?


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Gooner
01 January 2015 21:19:53


 


Well there's always a chance of pattern change. You can say that any day of the year and it's accurate. 


In the meantime it looks rather tedious, albeit at least it's not cold. I do realise I leave myself open here to Gooner posting a line of numbers and telling me it's not beach weather like it usually is in January 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 


I will save you from that Matthew


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Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
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Brendon Hills Bandit
01 January 2015 22:25:04


So with near record global temps (due to hot oceans) and DMI80N showing low Arctic temps would that hint at more energy in the weather machine as it fights to even things out?


Until the Arctic is ice free over winter ( and shrouded in fog keeping it warm over the sunless months) a warming planet must surely spawn energetic weather as the difference, pole to equator, increases?


Originally Posted by: Gray-Wolf 


 


You're probably more of an expert than I am, but I thought that it has long been said that the arctic is warming faster than any where else on the planet, possibly reducing the temperature difference pole to equator.


But maybe things have changed recently, pretty sure that the arctic ice extent has risen in the last 2-3 years. Odd.


220m asl, edge of Brendon Hills
Solar Cycles
01 January 2015 22:27:23


So with near record global temps (due to hot oceans) and DMI80N showing low Arctic temps would that hint at more energy in the weather machine as it fights to even things out?


Until the Arctic is ice free over winter ( and shrouded in fog keeping it warm over the sunless months) a warming planet must surely spawn energetic weather as the difference, pole to equator, increases?


Originally Posted by: Gray-Wolf 

😴😴😴

Andy J
02 January 2015 15:48:31


The first half of December will be relatively mild with a chance of a cold snap. Through the second half of December, I think the risk gradually increases of colder weather, with a fairly strong signal for cold at the end of December, into the start of January.


December 2014: Near average rainfall and temperatures. 


Originally Posted by: Andy J 


I don't think I was far off the mark with my December forecast.  It looks like it ended up a close to average month for temperatures (slightly mild depending on which CET series you use).  It was an average month for rainfall in my location, although it looks like it was a little below average in other areas.    The end of of December cold period perhaps came a little earlier than expected, and finished a little earlier than expected.  So overall, fairly pleased with the forecast so far.  Will just give a reminder of my original prognosis for January & February 2015:


Milder Atlantic air encroaches into the UK at times for the middle two weeks of January.   However, I think there will be much more significant period of cold towards the end of January and lasting until the middle of February. Certainly a strong risk of snowfall associated with this. Probably drier and less cold in the second half of February.


January 2015: Rather cold, near normal rainfall
February 2015: Rather cold and dry, (drier further north, colder further south-east)


 


 


 


Gainsborough, Lincolnshire.
Caz
  • Caz
  • Advanced Member
03 January 2015 22:06:59


We can't possibly forecast that far ahead and we even struggle to get it right beyond five days.  However, my gut feeling is that we're in another run of mild winters.


Originally Posted by: Caz 

My post from 21st August.  Nothing scientific, just a gut feeling and memories of a few decades of weather under my belt.  Even though we've just had a cold snap with snow, I don't think we'll get much more and I still think it will be relatively mild over all. 


I often wonder if humans have, or once had, a gut instinct for weather, like some animals do.  Maybe we do still have it deep down but it's overpowered by our much stronger feelings of wishful thinking. 


Market Warsop, North Nottinghamshire.
Join the fun and banter of the monthly CET competition.
KevBrads1
04 January 2015 08:39:38

It's been a strange feeling winter. It doesn't feel like it has been wintry even though I have seen more frosts than last winter thus far and the field behind me was snow covered from Boxing Day night to New Year's Eve, the longest period such period since December 2010


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bruced
04 January 2015 11:40:25

Please could someone direct me to a solar monitoring website?  There was an excellent solar cycle thread in the now non-existent climate forum on TWO and I don't know if there is a thread any more.


I'm thinking that solar activity might still be high as we are just past the peak of this current cycle, and this might be contributing to our relatively mild winter (although it is colder than last year's mild fest).


Thank you


David


Northallerton


David
KevBrads1
04 January 2015 12:48:56

I wonder whether people felt the same in 1939-40, 1981-2 and 1990-1? They all occurred just after the peak of a solar cycle.

1947 was just three months before the peak.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_solar_cycles

I do know what you mean though. There's a fair list of "Hale" winters to choose from too. Just thought I'd throw those examples out there.

Originally Posted by: some faraway beach 


The 5 great winters of the 20th century (1916-17, 1928-29, 1939-40, 1962-63, 1978-79) , 3 of them occurred near a solar maxima.


I don't know what has happened to me recently but my scepticism has deepened. People are blaming solar activity for this winter not delivering so far. Solar activity is lower than a number of recent peaks. Low solar activity alone doesn't explain the great winters above.


We are told sudden stratospheric warming events increases the chance of northerly blocking and cold episodes.


I go along with that but it doesn't explain a number of cold outbreaks. Where was the SSW that resulted in late Nov-Dec 2010? The coldest part of winter 1976-77 occurred before the SSW. 


I would say  that a SSW gives you a chance of breaking out of a weather pattern but if you are in a cold pattern and you want to maintain it, would you want a SSW to occur?


Then there is OPI and SAI. It seems that things are not going according to plan here. The trouble seems to be the low pressure anomaly over the Barents-Kara region. 


NAO, AO, OPI, SAI, PDO, AMO, SSW, MWW, ENSO.....it's an alphabet soup of complexities.


 


 


 


MANCHESTER SUMMER INDEX for 2021: 238
Timelapses, old weather forecasts and natural phenomena videos can be seen on this site
http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCgrSD1BwFz2feWDTydhpEhQ/playlists
ARTzeman
04 January 2015 12:53:54


Please could someone direct me to a solar monitoring website?  There was an excellent solar cycle thread in the now non-existent climate forum on TWO and I don't know if there is a thread any more.


I'm thinking that solar activity might still be high as we are just past the peak of this current cycle, and this might be contributing to our relatively mild winter (although it is colder than last year's mild fest).


Thank you


David


Northallerton


Originally Posted by: bruced 


Current Solar Data: NOAA data 


Maybe handy.






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Others just get wet.
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ARTzeman
04 January 2015 14:52:35


 


Current Solar Data: NOAA data 


Maybe handy.


Originally Posted by: ARTzeman 

Or 


SpaceWeather.com


 






Some people walk in the rain.
Others just get wet.
I Just Blow my horn or trumpet
ARTzeman
04 January 2015 16:10:36

Solarham.net


Solarmonitor.org


tesilebeder.ru


 


All have solar charts.






Some people walk in the rain.
Others just get wet.
I Just Blow my horn or trumpet
Twister
04 January 2015 16:38:45

A sub 2C day today around here - could be one of the coldest maxima of the year! 


Location: Egerton, Kent - 33m ASL
Thunder 2016: 12 (Apr 3,13; May 21; Jun 8,11,17,22,23,25, Jul 2,12, Aug 26)
Winter 2015/6: Snowfalls: 10 | Snowcover: 2 (Jan 17 (0.5cm)) | Air frosts: 39
Winter 2016/7: Snowfalls: 4 (Jan 12-3, Feb 10-11) | Snowcover: 2 (Jan 13, 2cm, Feb 11, 3-5mm) | Air frosts: 57 (2 in Oct, 10 in Nov, 13 in Dec, 19 in Jan, 6 in Feb, 3 in Mar, 4 in Apr)
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Jonesy
05 January 2015 11:48:47

Does anyone remember the year when Winter was poor for snow & cold but then as soon as early spring arrived we got a fair bit of snow in the South?


What odds on that happening again this year 


 


Medway Towns (Kent)
The Weather will do what it wants, when it wants, no matter what data is thrown at it !
Stormchaser
05 January 2015 17:32:28


Does anyone remember the year when Winter was poor for snow & cold but then as soon as early spring arrived we got a fair bit of snow in the South?


What odds on that happening again this year 


 


Originally Posted by: Jonesy 


Was that 2008 when we got a heavy fall in Easter?


 


I am actually becoming quite worried that the coldest patterns will be developing later in February and persisting through March this year, similar to 2013.


March 2013 was interesting as a case study but delivered nothing more than a bit of wet snow that melted on contact with the ground. The impact on SSTs then made warm conditions here in the far south rather restricted until late June that year. I also think they held back July 2013 a bit and prevented it from being close to 2006 in terms of the heat... admittedly a silver lining for those who don't fare well in such conditions.


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Keep Calm and Forecast On
bruced
05 January 2015 22:58:32


 


Was that 2008 when we got a heavy fall in Easter?


 


I am actually becoming quite worried that the coldest patterns will be developing later in February and persisting through March this year, similar to 2013.


March 2013 was interesting as a case study but delivered nothing more than a bit of wet snow that melted on contact with the ground. The impact on SSTs then made warm conditions here in the far south rather restricted until late June that year. I also think they held back July 2013 a bit and prevented it from being close to 2006 in terms of the heat... admittedly a silver lining for those who don't fare well in such conditions.


Originally Posted by: Stormchaser 


 


If the cold comes towards the end of Feb and persist through March then, IMO, all well and good.  If nothing else, it will potentially be the first period (of more than a few days) of colder than average conditions since August (or possibly earlier). If the cold does come, it might hopefully be the beginning of a cooler few months/year, although I'm probably stretching my imagination a bit too much here!!


David


Northallerton


David
Jonesy
06 January 2015 09:17:22


 


Was that 2008 when we got a heavy fall in Easter?


 


Originally Posted by: Stormchaser 


I think your right stormchaser and from memory it was a Sunday night, I remember sitting in my lounge and noticing something out the window, it took a good minute or so to sink in that it was actually snowing, I can't remember the actual 2007/2008 Winter though so not sure if the April (Sring) snowfall was all we had??


Medway Towns (Kent)
The Weather will do what it wants, when it wants, no matter what data is thrown at it !
Saint Snow
06 January 2015 09:27:32

With the charts out to mid-Jan showing nothing cold & snowy, that's half of winter gone with no decent cold spell*


Another winter turning into a dud?



 


 


 


* the post-Xmas spell here gave a snowfall that was half-melted by drizzle/rain afterwards, followed by a few frosts - distinctly underwhelming



Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
bradders
06 January 2015 16:38:39


 


I think your right stormchaser and from memory it was a Sunday night, I remember sitting in my lounge and noticing something out the window, it took a good minute or so to sink in that it was actually snowing, I can't remember the actual 2007/2008 Winter though so not sure if the April (Sring) snowfall was all we had??


Originally Posted by: Jonesy 

We had an inch of snow on Easter Sunday night, 23rd  March 2008.


Another overnight snowfall of an inch on 6/7th April, a Sunday night again.


We also had some snow showers on the evening of 1st February. The winter overall was fairly mild here.



Eric. Cheadle Hulme, Stockport.
Medlock Vale Weather
06 January 2015 19:09:57


We had an inch of snow on Easter Sunday night, 23rd  March 2008.


Another overnight snowfall of an inch on 6/7th April, a Sunday night again.


We also had some snow showers on the evening of 1st February. The winter overall was fairly mild here.


Originally Posted by: bradders 


Had about 4 inches of snow here that night, was quite unexpected as it wasn't forecasted for more than a cm or so. We've had a few snowy March's over the past 10 years or so, most notably 2006, 2008, 2013. Can we get another one? I wouldn't bet against it. It would seem early Spring is more favourable to get cold to our shores as the Atlantic traditionally settles down. 


Alan in Medlock Valley - Oldham's frost hollow. 103 metres above sea level.
What is a frost hollow? http://www.weatheronline.co.uk/reports/wxfacts/Frost-hollow.htm 
Whether Idle
06 January 2015 19:30:41


 


Had about 4 inches of snow here that night, was quite unexpected as it wasn't forecasted for more than a cm or so. We've had a few snowy March's over the past 10 years or so, most notably 2006, 2008, 2013. Can we get another one? I wouldn't bet against it. It would seem early Spring is more favourable to get cold to our shores as the Atlantic traditionally settles down. 


Originally Posted by: Medlock Vale Weather 


March has long been snowier than December for many areas and I think that trend has intensified over a long term average of 30 years.


Dover, 5m asl. Half a mile from the south coast.

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