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Col
  • Col
  • Advanced Member
31 July 2019 15:31:38


 


You can right click and 'measure distance' on Google from a PC. I measure it at pretty much dead on 1.5m at the shortest distance



Originally Posted by: andy-manc 


They could of course move the screen into the centre of that patch, it does look a little odd like that, even if the 1.5m distance has been maintained. I guess with this being a botanic gardens and all, cultivated & uncultivated areas are going to be constantly changing.


 


Col
Bolton, Lancashire
160m asl
Snow videos:
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Snow Hoper
31 July 2019 15:38:58
That's one thing that bugs me with all this. The met office have an army of would be data collectors, probably for free, if they just took the time etc to implement it. I for one would gladly provide data with the right equipment, at no cost, because it's my love of the information and extremes that fuels it all.
Going to war over religion is like killing each other to see who has the better imaginary friend.


Home : Thorndon, Suffolk.
james
31 July 2019 15:44:16


They could of course move the screen into the centre of that patch, it does look a little odd like that, even if the 1.5m distance has been maintained. I guess with this being a botanic gardens and all, cultivated & uncultivated areas are going to be constantly changing.


Originally Posted by: Col 


It's not usual to have the screen 1.5m from one edge of the defined area, because it needs it to be sufficiently far away from other instruments e.g. the rain gauge.

lanky
31 July 2019 16:04:42

This is the 5km grid Average Maximum Temperature for the UK on 10th August 2003 showing just SE England with Brogdale highlighted


(click in the image for a bigger version)



It can be seen that the Brogdale area is somewhat split off from the main area of higher temperature and a number of nearby cells are 2 -3 degrees C lower


As was mentioned earlier, this could be the effect of local topography and not an erroneous reading


This is Met Office data but they do not explain how these 5km cells are populated. They obviously include local stations in the area but here must also be quite a bit of averaging, projection and interpolation to get full coverage of the 10,000 or so cells which make up the UK


 


Martin
Richmond, Surrey
LeedsLad123
31 July 2019 16:17:35

That's one thing that bugs me with all this. The met office have an army of would be data collectors, probably for free, if they just took the time etc to implement it. I for one would gladly provide data with the right equipment, at no cost, because it's my love of the information and extremes that fuels it all.

Originally Posted by: Snow Hoper 


Yes - please Met Office if you’re reading this, send me some top notch equipment and I’ll happily take readings for you. laughing


Whitkirk, Leeds - 85m ASL.
Rob K
31 July 2019 17:10:58


The met office said the overall overnight minimum record didn't go, however Brogdale shows a minimum of 24.3c in the 24hr period of July 25th to 26th

 


http://wow.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/view?&reportId=8082001&siteID=25668314


 


Originally Posted by: Gavin D 


Where are you finding that reading? As far as I can tell this is the 0900Z data for |July 26 and it shows a minimum of 20.0C, with 24.3C the reading at 0900Z.


 


http://wow.metoffice.gov.uk/observations/details/201907263foef47xtye6ucrdyyb96sccar


 


The highest minimum was for 23-24 July, at 21.3C: http://wow.metoffice.gov.uk/observations/details/20190724o6e55hpqdre6ucrdyyb96sp8dh


 


 


 


Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl
"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome
Retron
31 July 2019 18:00:16


It can be seen that the Brogdale area is somewhat split off from the main area of higher temperature and a number of nearby cells are 2 -3 degrees C lower


As was mentioned earlier, this could be the effect of local topography and not an erroneous reading


This is Met Office data but they do not explain how these 5km cells are populated. They obviously include local stations in the area but here must also be quite a bit of averaging, projection and interpolation to get full coverage of the 10,000 or so cells which make up the UK


Originally Posted by: lanky 


The cells to the immediate north are Sheppey, so yes - they would be a fair bit lower due to the cooling effect of the marshes and the Swale.


As I keep saying, it's the local topography that results in Faversham (and Sittingbourne, to the west, for that matter) being a hotspot IF the conditions are right. Take it from a local!


Leysdown, north Kent
Gusty
02 August 2019 09:36:53

Hi all.


Just back from France. We missed the exceptional UK heatwave but experienced 41c (106f) near Angers on the car thermo.


Catching up on my stats imagine my shock at seeing 39.2c as my max on the 25th July.


My first reaction is an erroneous reading.


However...Langdon Bay reached 35.9c that day at 130m asl jutting out into the Dover Strait. I normally record 3 degress warmer than that location.


A couple of questions.


How did IDJ and Whether Idle compare that day ? If my reading is accurate then I expect to see a T2M of 38+ from my local buddies who are located at sea level close to the shoreline.


I'm trying to piece things together but mysteriously Wundermap had a number of local weather stations out of action that day.


Thanks 


Steve - Folkestone, Kent
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Snow Hoper
02 August 2019 14:28:43


Hi all.


Just back from France. We missed the exceptional UK heatwave but experienced 41c (106f) near Angers on the car thermo.


Catching up on my stats imagine my shock at seeing 39.2c as my max on the 25th July.


My first reaction is an erroneous reading.


However...Langdon Bay reached 35.9c that day at 130m asl jutting out into the Dover Strait. I normally record 3 degress warmer than that location.


A couple of questions.


How did IDJ and Whether Idle compare that day ? If my reading is accurate then I expect to see a T2M of 38+ from my local buddies who are located at sea level close to the shoreline.


I'm trying to piece things together but mysteriously Wundermap had a number of local weather stations out of action that day.


Thanks 


Originally Posted by: Gusty 


Hi Steve, 


Can't be sure, but I think Ian's Vue went up by like 3C in an Hour from 35C to 38C sometime after 3pm. He was quite uneasy about it like you are with yours. Mine up here got to 37.6C but although in open space and over grass is in full sun (cant odds it).


Going to war over religion is like killing each other to see who has the better imaginary friend.


Home : Thorndon, Suffolk.
Gusty
02 August 2019 15:29:23


 Hi Steve, 


Can't be sure, but I think Ian's Vue went up by like 3C in an Hour from 35C to 38C sometime after 3pm. 


Originally Posted by: Snow Hoper 


Thanks Snowhoper. That's really useful to understand.


Hopefully Whether Idle and Ian can verify soon.


It sounds as there was some sort of event that turned a very hot day to an historic day down here on the corner. The max occured at 17:01hrs. Unfortunately due to the lack of Met Office official stations around here means we'll never know.


 


Steve - Folkestone, Kent
Current conditions from my Davis Vantage Vue
https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/IFOLKE11 
Join Kent Weather on Facebook.
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Tim A
02 August 2019 15:42:37

Were there any record minimums recorded?
I recorded 21.0c min Thr/Fri night which is the highest I have ever recorded. Missed this thread from Friday morning onwards due to being away. 


Tim
NW Leeds
187m asl

 My PWS 
Rob K
02 August 2019 17:02:08


Were there any record minimums recorded?
I recorded 21.0c min Thr/Fri night which is the highest I have ever recorded. Missed this thread from Friday morning onwards due to being away. 


Originally Posted by: Tim A 


I believe the Scottish record minimum went. 20.9C minimum at Achnagart on 25th/26th. https://twitter.com/metoffice/status/1154680158105800704


 


Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl
"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome
Caz
  • Caz
  • Advanced Member
02 August 2019 17:15:34


Thanks Snowhoper. That's really useful to understand.


Hopefully Whether Idle and Ian can verify soon.


It sounds as there was some sort of event that turned a very hot day to an historic day down here on the corner. The max occured at 17:01hrs. Unfortunately due to the lack of Met Office official stations around here means we'll never know.


 

Originally Posted by: Gusty 

Temps rose quickly from early in the day then quite a few places experienced cloud cover for an hour or so around 3 o clock (edit: just looked through thread and cloud started around 1 o clock) that afternoon and a bit of rain, which cooled it down slightly.  It looked like we might not get to the record but once it cleared temps started to rise even further, so most places peaked at teatime. 


To get an idea of what it was like, it really would be worth reading this thread!  I know it’s a long one but reading it will help you understand and I think Ian and WI might have posted their temps.  Go for it Steve!  


Market Warsop, North Nottinghamshire.
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Gusty
02 August 2019 17:52:39


 I think Ian and WI might have posted their temps.  Go for it Steve!  


Originally Posted by: Caz 


I've got a couple of hours spare later... I'll give it a trawl Caz 


Steve - Folkestone, Kent
Current conditions from my Davis Vantage Vue
https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/IFOLKE11 
Join Kent Weather on Facebook.
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Stormchaser
02 August 2019 19:00:30

I think there was a period of 1-2 hours on the afternoon of Thu 25th when the flow not only aligned perfectly with the hottest part of N. France, during the peak of the day's heat - or close to it, but was also orientated such that it crossed close to the shortest possible stretch of water on the way over to SE England.


So it's possible that a wedge of over 40*C heat was shifted rapidly across to the far SE of England, only having time to cool into the very high 30s by the time it reached Folkestone.


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Hungry Tiger
02 August 2019 20:14:04


I think there was a period of 1-2 hours on the afternoon of Thu 25th when the flow not only aligned perfectly with the hottest part of N. France, during the peak of the day's heat - or close to it, but was also orientated such that it crossed close to the shortest possible stretch of water on the way over to SE England.


So it's possible that a wedge of over 40*C heat was shifted rapidly across to the far SE of England, only having time to cool into the very high 30s by the time it reached Folkestone.


Originally Posted by: Stormchaser 


40C is the next target in this country and I doubt it will be long before it's hit.


 


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Caz
  • Caz
  • Advanced Member
02 August 2019 20:29:17


 


40C is the next target in this country and I doubt it will be long before it's hit.


 


Originally Posted by: Hungry Tiger 

It really wouldn’t surprise me if some places did actually reach 40c, just not the places with official stations.  My sensor recorded over 39c IMBY but the nearest Met office station only got to 38.4c but I live in a small valley which would be a heat trap, so I don’t think my reading was far wrong.  I’m pretty sure there were other places that were genuinely hotter, but not officially.  


Market Warsop, North Nottinghamshire.
Join the fun and banter of the monthly CET competition.
Gusty
02 August 2019 21:02:00


I think there was a period of 1-2 hours on the afternoon of Thu 25th when the flow not only aligned perfectly with the hottest part of N. France, during the peak of the day's heat - or close to it, but was also orientated such that it crossed close to the shortest possible stretch of water on the way over to SE England.


So it's possible that a wedge of over 40*C heat was shifted rapidly across to the far SE of England, only having time to cool into the very high 30s by the time it reached Folkestone.


Originally Posted by: Stormchaser 


Thanks SC. That's re-assuring. Northern France was 41c at around 5pm and from all accounts there was a fair ole SSE'ly breeze blowing..hence allowing for minimal modification.


I've a Davis vantage vue and very happy with the results it gives. Bear in mind the siting of this station has remained in position since Sept 2006 and has sat through many heatwaves. Previous max 33.9c ! 


39.2c is staggering.


I'd happily accept a margin of error for over exposure of 0.5c or so given its not fan assisted.


Nevertheless I'm pretty sure had a Met Office official station been located somewhere in the vicinity of Folkestone a figure of very close to 39c would have been achieved on this already historic afternoon. 


 


 


 


 


 


Steve - Folkestone, Kent
Current conditions from my Davis Vantage Vue
https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/IFOLKE11 
Join Kent Weather on Facebook.
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Tim A
05 August 2019 11:17:38


 


I've got a couple of hours spare later... I'll give it a trawl Caz 


Originally Posted by: Gusty 


 


If you missed this, it is worth a read. Couldn't believe it when I saw the hourly readings come out at the time. 


https://www.grimsbytelegraph.co.uk/news/local-news/temperatures-suddenly-shot-up-ten-3138661


There could have been other examples across the country.


Tim
NW Leeds
187m asl

 My PWS 
johncs2016
05 August 2019 12:02:27


 


 


If you missed this, it is worth a read. Couldn't believe it when I saw the hourly readings come out at the time. 


https://www.grimsbytelegraph.co.uk/news/local-news/temperatures-suddenly-shot-up-ten-3138661


There could have been other examples across the country.


Originally Posted by: Tim A 


I can clearly see that the article in question went out before its authors had learned about the actual temperature of 38.7°C  as recorded at Cambridge Botanic Gardens being confirmed as the new all-time UK record.


Nevertheless, that is quite an interesting phenomenon which makes that article, well worth reading.


 


The north of Edinburgh, usually always missing out on snow events which occur not just within the rest of Scotland or the UK, but also within the rest of Edinburgh.
Whether Idle
08 August 2019 13:20:37


 


Thanks SC. That's re-assuring. Northern France was 41c at around 5pm and from all accounts there was a fair ole SSE'ly breeze blowing..hence allowing for minimal modification.


I've a Davis vantage vue and very happy with the results it gives. Bear in mind the siting of this station has remained in position since Sept 2006 and has sat through many heatwaves. Previous max 33.9c ! 


39.2c is staggering.


I'd happily accept a margin of error for over exposure of 0.5c or so given its not fan assisted.


Nevertheless I'm pretty sure had a Met Office official station been located somewhere in the vicinity of Folkestone a figure of very close to 39c would have been achieved on this already historic afternoon. 


 


 


 


 


 


Originally Posted by: Gusty 


Hi Steve. Back now from 2 week break!  Left on the morning of 25th July. I Posted on that day a transect of car temps. On my return this morning I Downloaded my Davis VP 2 data. Saw Your post and was thinking that if the very exposed clifftoppermost Langdon Bay was 35.9, that on the basis of hot day maxima over the past 14 years at this site, that my valley bottom max would be 2-3 degrees higher. Also, given your 39.2, I was expecting my max to be somewhere around half a degree Celsius lower than yours, as you will recall that you are usually about +0.5 c from me on scorchio days.


So, on that basis I was anticipating something in the region of 38.5 c. In fact I recorded 38.6. So very close to the expectation. So. The evidence does indeed suggest that the   Defecto ( if not the official, I hasten to add) national record may well belong to the South East Kent Massive. 


WI. 


Dover, 5m asl. Half a mile from the south coast.
Gusty
08 August 2019 13:28:12


 Hi Steve. Back now from 2 week break!  Left on the morning of 25th July. I Posted on that day a transect of car temps. On my return this morning I Downloaded by Davis VP 2 data. Saw Your post and was thinking that if Langdon Bay was 35.9 that on the basis of hot day maxima over the past 14 years at this site, that my valley bottom max would be 2-3 degrees higher. Also, given your 39.2, I was expecting my max to be somewhere around half a degree Celsius lower than yours, as you will recall that you are usually about +0.5 c from me on scorchio days.


So, on that basis I was anticipating something in the region of 38.5 c. In fact I recorded 38.6. So very close to the expectation. So. The evidence does indeed suggest that the   Defecto ( if not the official, I hasten to add) national record may well belong to the South East Kent Massive. 


WI. 


Originally Posted by: Whether Idle 


Excellent Phil...thank you.


To summarise


IDJ - Coastal Folkestone 38.3c (100.9f)


WI - Semi coastal Dover 38.6c (101.5f)


Gusty - Inland Folkestone 39.2c (102.6f)


Wow.  For the SE Kent massive when the previous record was probably closer to 36c 97f. What an extraordinary day that was. One to tell the grandchildren.


Its just a shame that it will never been shown officially.


We know though. 


Steve - Folkestone, Kent
Current conditions from my Davis Vantage Vue
https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/IFOLKE11 
Join Kent Weather on Facebook.
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Bertwhistle
09 August 2019 07:26:10

Fascinating conversation.


I wonder if modification but also have been limited by the hot air failing to mix at all with the cooler surface air over the water, and like laminar flow in a river, simply skated across the top of the cool, finally making landfall a few m ASL on reaching the Kent coast. Temperatures on the open water would then be much lower, and under the circumstances there wasn't enough time for a sea breeze set up.


Bertie, Itchen Valley.
Retire while you can still press the 'retire now' button.
Tim A
09 August 2019 08:41:28

A thread for the classic forum surely?
It is clear reading this that 25th July should go down as a truely historic day. Not just because the record was broken in Cambridge but because many areas experienced their hottest day ever. The records were much more widespread than 10th August 2003.


All this with damp ground (here at least) and no build up of heat over days/weeks.


Tim
NW Leeds
187m asl

 My PWS 
johncs2016
09 August 2019 08:47:47


A thread for the classic forum surely?
It is clear reading this that 25th July should go down as a truely historic day. Not just because the record was broken in Cambridge but because many areas experienced their hottest day ever. The records were much more widespread than 10th August 2003.


All this with damp ground (here at least) and no build up of heat over days/weeks.


Originally Posted by: Tim A 


I agree with that and what makes that even more remarkable is that most people would normally expect these high temperature records to be more likely to be broken during a really good summer such as what we had during the first half of last summer in particular. This summer hasn't been as good overall as last summer and yet, this hasn't stopped those records from being broken on this occasion.


The north of Edinburgh, usually always missing out on snow events which occur not just within the rest of Scotland or the UK, but also within the rest of Edinburgh.

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