Remove ads from site

nsrobins
12 December 2013 22:41:14

Nothing too much to report on the 18Z run?



I'll pop back in on Sunday whilst the Mrs is watching the Strictly results show.



 


Neil
Fareham, Hampshire 28m ASL (near estuary)
Stormchaser, Member TORRO
SnowyHythe(Kent)
12 December 2013 22:51:33
Is it just me that thinks GFS FI is *trying* to settle the arctic down with signs of the PV loosening it's grip?
As we run in to the New Year, I am becoming more optimistic.
Gooner
12 December 2013 23:07:34

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn961.png


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn9617.png


Contrast in temps North to South


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Gooner
12 December 2013 23:09:06

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn3121.png


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn31217.png


Xmas day will feel seasonal at least


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Gooner
12 December 2013 23:10:36

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn33617.png


Boxing day is chilly


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn36017.png


And the day after is even colder


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Gandalf The White
12 December 2013 23:21:46

ECM isn't really supporting anything colder yet.


London ensemble from the 12z: http://www.weathercast.co.uk/services/ensemble-forecast.html


The precipitation amounts have been cranked up over the last day or two - now the driest run still delivers over 20mm and the mean is 60mm.  The 3 wet periods shown in the Op are well supported by the mean as regards timing and broadly as regards amounts.


There's just the odd run out of 50 that shows any minima below freezing until 27th, aside from one rogue outlier on 23rd.


 


Location: South Cambridgeshire
130 metres ASL
52.0N 0.1E


Quantum
13 December 2013 00:01:54

The good run yesterday has not been repeated today on the ECM.


 


Twitter: @QuantumOverlord (general), @MedicaneWatch (medicane/TC stuff)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
Retron
13 December 2013 03:57:44

If the ECM-32 control run is correct then there's no sign of anything especially cold all the way out to the 13th January - just lots of wind, rain and WSW'lies/SW'lies. There are a couple of days with NW'lies in early January but then the Azores High ridges northwards and collapses in such a way as to reset the jet on a more northerly track again.

Hopefully that won't actually be the case, as otherwise that'd be half of winter down the drain!


Leysdown, north Kent
Retron
13 December 2013 05:03:57
GFS shows an extremely rare event this morning - snow down here on Christmas Day! The last time that happened was 1970, not that I'm actually expecting this chart to be correct.

http://images.meteociel.fr/im/7550/gfs-2-300_jnq2.png 

It does show something interesting though, in that snow on a westerly, zonal flow is pretty much unknown here. Zonal snow falling on Christmas Day down here would be nothing short of a miracle.
Leysdown, north Kent
Hendon Snowman
13 December 2013 05:52:04


If the ECM-32 control run is correct then there's no sign of anything especially cold all the way out to the 13th January - just lots of wind, rain and WSW'lies/SW'lies. There are a couple of days with NW'lies in early January but then the Azores High ridges northwards and collapses in such a way as to reset the jet on a more northerly track again.

Hopefully that won't actually be the case, as otherwise that'd be half of winter down the drain!


Originally Posted by: Retron 


 


That would be a real bummer

Scandy 1050 MB
13 December 2013 06:59:46



If the ECM-32 control run is correct then there's no sign of anything especially cold all the way out to the 13th January - just lots of wind, rain and WSW'lies/SW'lies. There are a couple of days with NW'lies in early January but then the Azores High ridges northwards and collapses in such a way as to reset the jet on a more northerly track again.

Hopefully that won't actually be the case, as otherwise that'd be half of winter down the drain!


Originally Posted by: Hendon Snowman 


 


That would be a real bummer


Originally Posted by: Retron 


Not sure why I look at each run anymore - could cut and paste from yesterday, and the day before and so on...even in deep FI still the same:


 


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/ecmwf.php?ech=240&mode=1&map=0&archive=0


 


No change yet again so for coldies I think it's getting to the stage now where unless something drastic changes soon and pressure leaks away to the south and rises in the far north, December is a wasted winter month, just 2 winter months left. May not even be that if the ECM-32 is right as Darren mentions.

Gooner
13 December 2013 07:16:06




If the ECM-32 control run is correct then there's no sign of anything especially cold all the way out to the 13th January - just lots of wind, rain and WSW'lies/SW'lies. There are a couple of days with NW'lies in early January but then the Azores High ridges northwards and collapses in such a way as to reset the jet on a more northerly track again.

Hopefully that won't actually be the case, as otherwise that'd be half of winter down the drain!


Originally Posted by: Scandy 1050 MB 


 


That would be a real bummer


Originally Posted by: Hendon Snowman 


Not sure why I look at each run anymore - could cut and paste from yesterday, and the day before and so on...even in deep FI still the same:


 


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/ecmwf.php?ech=240&mode=1&map=0&archive=0


 


No change yet again so for coldies I think it's getting to the stage now where unless something drastic changes soon and pressure leaks away to the south and rises in the far north, December is a wasted winter month, just 2 winter months left. May not even be that if the ECM-32 is right as Darren mentions.


Originally Posted by: Retron 


It was last year here, no snow until January 20th then it lasted on the ground for ages , plenty of time


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Gusty
13 December 2013 07:16:10

Despite nothing remotely deeply cold in terms of airmass and longevity, this mornings longer range GFS is interesting.


 


The GFS continues to model the transferrence of the polar vortex towards the UK leading to a much more unsettled, wet, volatile but crucially a slacker situation.


Darren's christmas day chart illustrates perfectly well the potential under slack conditions when secondary lows are spawned to the south of the main vortex.


It may not be the armeggedon northerlies and easterlies with deep cold uppers but there is definately the longer term potential for surprise evaporative cooling snow events at times in the longe range.


We appear to lose the tropical maritime airmasses in favour of a more persistent polar maritime influence after 168 hours. 


It sure beats endless days of Tropical maritime airmasses, hill fog, drizzle and maxes stuck between 8-11c for days on end.


Steve - Folkestone, Kent
Current conditions from my Davis Vantage Vue
https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/IFOLKE11 
Join Kent Weather on Facebook.
https://www.facebook.com/stevewall69/ 



Gooner
13 December 2013 07:17:58

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn3001.png


A seasonal feeling Xmas day


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn30017.png


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


sriram
13 December 2013 07:27:36

this winter is a real concern for winter fans


as we know all too well once a zonal pattern sets in of the Atlantic train like next week its damn hard to shift


But having said that last winter had a really Atlantic driven Dec, and the pattern changed big time in mid Jan with cold and snow and a spell if endless cold all the way through till March - so anything can happen


Sriram
Sedgley, West Midlands ( just south of Wolverhampton )
162m ASL
doctormog
13 December 2013 07:48:49

this winter is a real concern for winter fans


as we know all too well once a zonal pattern sets in of the Atlantic train like next week its damn hard to shift


But having said that last winter had a really Atlantic driven Dec, and the pattern changed big time in mid Jan with cold and snow and a spell if endless cold all the way through till March - so anything can happen

Originally Posted by: sriram 



Doesn't your last sentence render the previous one somewhat worthless? 😒

The transition to a more unsettled mobile flow continues in this morning's output with the GFS showing a cooler option of that them in the mid-term.
roger63
13 December 2013 07:51:15


this winter is a real concern for winter fans


as we know all too well once a zonal pattern sets in of the Atlantic train like next week its damn hard to shift


But having said that last winter had a really Atlantic driven Dec, and the pattern changed big time in mid Jan with cold and snow and a spell if endless cold all the way through till March - so anything can happen


Originally Posted by: sriram 


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfse_cartes.php?&ech=384&mode=0&carte=1


Albeit far out in FI the PV seems to be split and HP build to the east,so maybe some promise for January.


You are right to point out that last year in earlyJanuary things look set for Atlantic domination and within  2weeks a cold spell was on us.


As far as a Xmas day is concerned 95% of ensembles show mild zonal.This mornings 0h GFS has cooler air (Polar maritime) over the UK which chimes with yeterdays METO Forecast of a cooler interlude over Xmas period.

Essan
13 December 2013 08:11:31

GFS 00 op run very much an outlier this morning - most ens members still going for much milder unsettled conditions through to the end of the month

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/MS_-252_ens.png


Andy
Evesham, Worcs, Albion - 35m asl
Weather & Earth Science News 

Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job - DNA
GIBBY
13 December 2013 08:13:14

Hi everyone. Back to normal today with my report on the midnight outputs from GFS, UKMO, GEM, NAVGEM and ECM for today Friday December 13th 2013.


All models show a more unstable but still relatively mild SW flow now establishing over the UK with a series of troughs crossing slowly East through today and again over the weekend. A brief chillier and brighter period tomorrow will be followed by the flow strengthening and pressure steadily falling with the risk of heavier rain increasing for all with time. Winds will reach gale or severe gales at times as we move from the weekend into the new week with a brief lull likely on Tuesday as a ridge crosses East over the UK, meaning a drier and less windy day is likely when it would feel a little less mild.


GFS then ratchets up a very disturbed Atlantic with a lot of cold air coming out of the States and spinning up some powerful storm systems which lie to the North of the UK for some considerable time including the Christams period. This will allow some potentially very strong gusts of wind at times as squally bands of rain sweep West to East across the UK with showery weather following quickly behind. In the colder air there could be a surprise white Christmas for some as squally wintry showers are shown to affect the UK over the period with even the potential for some longer spells of rain, sleet and hill snow for a time in the South. Overall average temperatures look likely before it turns rather cold over the Christmas period. Little change in the unsettled and windy spell then concludes this morning's run.


UKMO this morning closes it's run next Thursday with very deep Low pressure near Iceland with a strong and increasingly chilly WNW flow over the UK. Rain will sweep East early in the day and clear East to be followed by frequent showers with hail and thunder and some sleet or snow over Northern hills as it begins to feel colder, especially in the North.


GEM today shows very unsettled weather towards the end of next week and on to the end of it's run with showers or longer spells of rain in strong to gale SW winds affecting all the UK at times. This run shows only brief colder incursions with showers before milder air sweeps back NE again.


NAVGEM also shows a colder and more showery period towards the end of next week quickly replaced by a return to milder air with gales and rain at times by the weekend.


ECM also shows a fast changing pattern later next week alternating between short showery and rather colder conditions with spells of rain on milder SW winds with only very short drier interludes in between in constantly strong to gale winds for many.


The GFS Ensembles today show a sine wave pattern between milder and colder interludes from alternating air masses between tropical and polar maritime air indicative of a fast changing and mobile Westerly airflow. The operational described above was a colder option, especially over the Christmas period with most members keeping Christmas mild and wet with some heavy rainfall for many, especially in the South as wave depressions sweep through.


The Jet Stream shows we have a powerful and changing little surge of energy crossing the Atlantic and the British Isles throughout the entire run keeping a very unsettled and potentially stormy spell of weather for many parts of the UK in the run up to Christmas and probably beyond.


In Summary today we are staring down the barrel of sustained and quite powerful at times Atlantic driven weather setup with deep depressions centred close to Northern Britain for much of the time. It will take some time for the deepest unsettled and stormy conditions to affect the South in a big way as it's not until the middle of next week that the removal and influence of High pressure embers to the SE finally leaves the South. Thereafter all areas will see spells of very windy and wet weather alternating with colder and more showery air and yes there will be some snow at times over Northern high ground and even the chance of a little on Southern hills too if the cold air digs far enough South behind the squally cold fronts. Any such wintryness will be transient though as the next system would quickly sweep milder air back NE again with gales and rain. So all in all a typical wintry and potentially stormy period of weather is to come when the day to day forecasts from the output will change markedly run to run within a pattern that is likely to change little.


Martin G
Kilmersdon Radstock Bath Somerset



Look up my New Facebook Weather Page  for all the latest up to the minute weather stories as they happen
ARTzeman
13 December 2013 08:23:32

Good output there Martin.


Some winter  is  on it's  way..






Some people walk in the rain.
Others just get wet.
I Just Blow my horn or trumpet
Quantum
13 December 2013 08:46:55

Great so we are left to inhale the farts of the fat american beast. 


 


Twitter: @QuantumOverlord (general), @MedicaneWatch (medicane/TC stuff)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
Jayni C
13 December 2013 08:54:42


Great so we are left to inhale the farts of the fat american beast. 


 


Originally Posted by: Quantum 


i know he occasionally comes out with a lot of hot air, but surely that's no way to talk about Joe B


Maunder Minimum
13 December 2013 09:19:27


Great so we are left to inhale the farts of the fat american beast. 


 


Originally Posted by: Quantum 


As has been stated repeatedly - when North America is frigid, western Europe is zonal. It is only to be expected as cold air moves off the eastern seaboard and interacts with maritime air over the Atlantic - that is the typical play in these scenarios.


Someone said Europe and the US both froze in 1978-79 however - would be nice to see some archive charts of that.


New world order coming.
The Beast from the East
13 December 2013 09:36:19

ECM ens also show nothing of interest for the rest of the month.


http://www.knmi.nl/exp/pluim/vijftiendaagse/index.php


 


As mentioned, hopefully we will switch to more polar maritime air as the pv sinks south, so it will feel a bit more wintry at least.


Dec 2011 and 2012 were also rubbish and the better stuff came later in the season. Hopefully the same will happen again though it could still end up like 1989


"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
Stormchaser
13 December 2013 10:02:32

We sure do look to be getting hammered by storms next week, with 3 or 4 spells of gales/severe gales in the space of 5 or 6 days!


What's more, if there are further corrections in the storm track to the SE as we have seen for this weekend, then we'll be facing direct hits even sooner than suggested by GFS and ECM.


Those storms will be feeding off deep cold generated by record U.S. snowcover, as it clashes with mild TM air in the Atlantic. Gradually, the thermal gradient will decline, as the Atlantic cools, but that still leaves the potential for a fortnight of fury.


It does appear that the blocking needs to take over the eastern U.S and Canada before we can escape, which the models don't really indicate will happen within the next two weeks.


If you have any problems or queries relating to TWO you can Email [email protected]

https://twitter.com/peacockreports 
2023's Homeland Extremes:
T-Max: 30.2°C 9th Sep (...!) | T-Min: -7.1°C 22nd & 23rd Jan | Wettest Day: 25.9mm 2nd Nov | Ice Days: 1 (2nd Dec -1.3°C in freezing fog)
Keep Calm and Forecast On
Users browsing this topic

Remove ads from site

Ads