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cowman
25 December 2013 08:16:53
Merry Christmas to you all.
Ally Pally Snowman
25 December 2013 08:49:58
Merry Christmas everybody and perhaps a Christmas present from ECM.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Recm2401.html 
Bishop's Stortford 85m ASL.
haghir22
25 December 2013 09:01:18

Better chance of a night with Cheryl Cole than a cold spell with this lot.



http://www.jp2webdesign.co.uk/ds/gfs.htm

Originally Posted by: Hungry Tiger 



Not with that awful tattoo.....

YNWA
haghir22
25 December 2013 09:02:21
Merry Christmas all, maybe just maybe hints of something for January?
YNWA
GIBBY
25 December 2013 09:03:18

Good morning and a very Merry Christmas to you all. Here is the latest look at the midnight outputs from GFS, UKMO, GEM, NAVGEM and ECM for today Wednesday December 25th 2013.


All models show a slightly showery SW flow across the UK with most inland places away from windward coasts having a dry Christmas Day with showers heavy and wintry near mostly Southern and Western Coasts and over Scotland. Pressure continues to rise gently tonight and for a time tomorrow but many places will be dry and bright. Later tomorrow a new Low is shown to approach NW Britain deepening rapidly and giving rise to a repeat of the wind and rain of Monday, come Friday with severe gales and heavy rain making a return to all areas before clearer showery conditions arrive in the West at the end of the day. The weekend then stays unsettled and windy with showers and sunny intervals and chilly weather with some wintry showers and gales slowly decreasing through the weekend. By the end of Sunday yet another Low pressure is shown to approach from the West.


GFS then shows a wet and windy start to next week as the next Low anchors up to the NW with SW winds with gales in exposure bring further rain and showers NE across all areas up to the New Year. Then the first week and a bit of 2014 continue to be very changeable and sometimes wet as further Low pressure crosses East to the North of the UK with rain and showers at times with the chance of some sleet or snow at times on the hills of the North especially later.


UKMO this morning shows deep Low pressure centred three to four hundred miles to the West of Ireland with a South or SW flow carrying a trough NE across the UK with rain at times for all though at this stage abnormally strong winds may not be an issue.


GEM shows a continuation of the fast moving Low pressure systems crossing the Atlantic and to the North of the UK with strong and locally gale force winds for much of the time continuing to carry spells of rain followed by showers in average temperatures and restricting any snowfall to the hills and mountains of the North.


NAVGEM is very similar with no let up in the sometimes wet and windy weather a week from now.


ECM keeps things very unsettled with a deep trough over the UK later in it's run showing very little signs of releasing it's grip. It does suck in rather colder air down across the UK from the NW which would turn some of the outbreaks of rain and showers to a more wintry mix especially over the hills from a weeks time.


The GFS Ensembles show very little sign of any pattern change anytime soon as the Atlantic train is allowed to continue it's current progression aided by a powerful Jet Stream and huge temperature contrasts over the other side of the Atlantic. High pressure may play a bigger role between the Low's offering some brief respite in the South for a day or two on occasion but overall the suggestion from the pack remains an unsettled one in average temperatures.


The Jet Stream remains it's undulating sine wave pattern across or just South of the UK spawning deep Low pressure areas crossing the Atlantic for some time to come. There is little overall sign of a significant enough change in this pattern to indicate any pattern change within the time frame of this morning's output.


In Summary it all looks more of the same this morning. All models show little if any sign of relenting from the often wet pattern of rain followed by showers as each successive Low crosses over. Thankfully the risk of damaging winds look less likely though winds will remain lively and gale force at times. Temperatures look like holding close to average throughout with just a few brief colder incursions shown from the NW on occasion when temperatures fall just a little below average supporting snow on Northern hills. Equally though there may be some milder days in the South as mild sectors pass through. All in all though the models have provided us with a very standard mobile Atlantic based outlook this Christmas morning. So my best advice is take a break from the models today and have a very merry Christmas with all your nearest and dearest.


Martin G
Kilmersdon Radstock Bath Somerset



Look up my New Facebook Weather Page  for all the latest up to the minute weather stories as they happen
Ally Pally Snowman
25 December 2013 09:10:03
Friday looks awful with the north of England in the firing line this time. Will also make the flooding worse again in the south.

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rukm601.html 
Bishop's Stortford 85m ASL.
sriram
25 December 2013 09:35:28
A merry christmas to all model watchers - hopefully we will be talking about severe cold and snow soon rather than rain and gales in the new year
Sriram
Sedgley, West Midlands ( just south of Wolverhampton )
162m ASL
JACKO4EVER
25 December 2013 09:54:28
Morning all.
Happy Christmas everyone. Standard Atlantic zonal fayre for the foreseeable with the odd colder interlude up North. It will be wet but at least the damaging winds show some signs of abating after the end of the week.
ARTzeman
25 December 2013 10:37:27

Thank you Martin for your output. The summary say's it all..


Merry Christmas outputers and readers...






Some people walk in the rain.
Others just get wet.
I Just Blow my horn or trumpet
Quantum
25 December 2013 11:09:00

ECM output interesting to say the least. Of course one swallow doesn't make a summer. 


Twitter: @QuantumOverlord (general), @MedicaneWatch (medicane/TC stuff)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
Polar Low
25 December 2013 11:36:44

Thanks very much Martin,


 A very merry and safe xmas and new year to all members at Two and thanks to Brian and all moderators who also make it all happen.


Tim


 

Retron
25 December 2013 11:41:35


ECM output interesting to say the least. Of course one swallow doesn't make a summer. 


Originally Posted by: Quantum 


Indeed - I would have thought there would have been more interest, but as it's Christmas I reckon people have other things to think about!


The 0z ECM-15 control run maintains the theme of a change of sorts towards the end of its run, with lows again moving ever southwards and eventually setting up an easterly for England and Wales. That, combined with the operational, yesterday's 12z and the 0z ECM-32 from yesterday is enough to make me take notice... it's likely the ECM model has picked up on a signal but as yet it's so far out the detail is hard to pin down.


Leysdown, north Kent
Quantum
25 December 2013 12:14:31



ECM output interesting to say the least. Of course one swallow doesn't make a summer. 


Originally Posted by: Retron 


Indeed - I would have thought there would have been more interest, but as it's Christmas I reckon people have other things to think about!


The 0z ECM-15 control run maintains the theme of a change of sorts towards the end of its run, with lows again moving ever southwards and eventually setting up an easterly for England and Wales. That, combined with the operational, yesterday's 12z and the 0z ECM-32 from yesterday is enough to make me take notice... it's likely the ECM model has picked up on a signal but as yet it's so far out the detail is hard to pin down.


Originally Posted by: Quantum 


I would call it tenous at the moment, the situation in the arctic is moderately good (but not perfect), and the blocking fairly weak. I would guess it would be enough provided the atlantic could just calm down for a short while. A spell of moderation over canada would really help. I'd put the odds at about 30% of this particular event coming to fruitation. 


Twitter: @QuantumOverlord (general), @MedicaneWatch (medicane/TC stuff)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
polarwind
25 December 2013 12:24:17
GFS shaping up nicely with this mornings run.
Beginning to look promising with some consistency about the low pressure to the south and pressure rising to the north
"The professional standards of science must impose a framework of discipline and at the same time encourage rebellion against it". – Michael Polyani (1962)
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Dave,Derby
Andy Woodcock
25 December 2013 12:54:22
Merry Christmas anyone and a bit of seasonal joy from ECM.

The 240 chart is indeed loaded with potential, of particular interest is that we lose the warm uppers over Europe with the Russian high nosing westward at high latitude. Pressure rises across Greenland although this is a 'Retron' Greeny high which may be a surface illusion.

Also the next low coming out the states is on a very southerly track which will tend to strengthen the northern blocking pattern.

Just one run but on its own it's probably the best chart outside deep FI that we have seen in weeks.

Andy
Andy Woodcock
Penrith
Cumbria

Altitude 535 feet

"Why are the British so worried about climate change? Any change to their climate can only be an improvement" John Daley 2001
Gooner
25 December 2013 12:55:58

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn3841.png


Chart of the Winter so far and was on the mild side in the ENS


 


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


nickl
25 December 2013 13:03:43

Merry Christmas anyone and a bit of seasonal joy from ECM.

The 240 chart is indeed loaded with potential, of particular interest is that we lose the warm uppers over Europe with the Russian high nosing westward at high latitude. Pressure rises across Greenland although this is a 'Retron' Greeny high which may be a surface illusion.

Also the next low coming out the states is on a very southerly track which will tend to strengthen the northern blocking pattern.

Just one run but on its own it's probably the best chart outside deep FI that we have seen in weeks.

Andy

Originally Posted by: Andy Woodcock 


cant see that the ecm suite supports strong height rises to our north. ncep/gem has been playing with this. ecm much flatter. the  consistent ecm signal is for the jet to align nw/se as the azores high pulls back towards newfoundland. the jet stays strong delivering systems into europe which have to pass across our part of nw europe. the track of these secondary lows will dictate where any snowfall ends up. not expecting anything of note before the 6th/7th.  there will have to some blocking to our north but i suspect it will be of the weak variety - weak but very effective. also possible tranisent amplified ridges between systems.

RobN
  • RobN
  • Advanced Member
25 December 2013 13:06:57

Interesting GFS 6Z.


Some buckling of the jet over US as the cold pool over North America digs so far south that it over extends itself. As the wave propagates it forces WAA up the west side of greenland. A couple of topplers to start with probably but it could be the start of a significant change.


Rob
In the flatlands of South Cambridgeshire 15m ASL.
Gandalf The White
25 December 2013 14:45:23


Merry Christmas anyone and a bit of seasonal joy from ECM.

The 240 chart is indeed loaded with potential, of particular interest is that we lose the warm uppers over Europe with the Russian high nosing westward at high latitude. Pressure rises across Greenland although this is a 'Retron' Greeny high which may be a surface illusion.

Also the next low coming out the states is on a very southerly track which will tend to strengthen the northern blocking pattern.

Just one run but on its own it's probably the best chart outside deep FI that we have seen in weeks.

Andy

Originally Posted by: nickl 


cant see that the ecm suite supports strong height rises to our north. ncep/gem has been playing with this. ecm much flatter. the  consistent ecm signal is for the jet to align nw/se as the azores high pulls back towards newfoundland. the jet stays strong delivering systems into europe which have to pass across our part of nw europe. the track of these secondary lows will dictate where any snowfall ends up. not expecting anything of note before the 6th/7th.  there will have to some blocking to our north but i suspect it will be of the weak variety - weak but very effective. also possible tranisent amplified ridges between systems.


Originally Posted by: Andy Woodcock 


Hi Nick and Merry Christmas


The ECM ensemble mean has been trending colder into the first week of the New year for several days now.  Initially beyond Day 10 there are two groupings, one with average temperatures and one with cold. By Days 14-15 the milder grouping just becomes scatter. The colder one gives highs of around 3C and overnight lows around -1/-2C.  Nothing very cold but certainly indicative of a change perhaps to colder zonality?


Another four bouts of rain showing up well, quite well supported by the Ensemble mean and very much in agreement with the GFS run.


So, another week to 10 days of zonality but gradually changing in nature as we head into the New Year.


 


 


Location: South Cambridgeshire
130 metres ASL
52.0N 0.1E


Edicius81
25 December 2013 15:24:20
Am I correct in remembering a few dream charts from Xmas past, that soon disappeared once the festive season was over? Aeroplane data or some such.
nickl
25 December 2013 15:29:48



Merry Christmas anyone and a bit of seasonal joy from ECM.

The 240 chart is indeed loaded with potential, of particular interest is that we lose the warm uppers over Europe with the Russian high nosing westward at high latitude. Pressure rises across Greenland although this is a 'Retron' Greeny high which may be a surface illusion.

Also the next low coming out the states is on a very southerly track which will tend to strengthen the northern blocking pattern.

Just one run but on its own it's probably the best chart outside deep FI that we have seen in weeks.

Andy

Originally Posted by: Gandalf The White 


cant see that the ecm suite supports strong height rises to our north. ncep/gem has been playing with this. ecm much flatter. the  consistent ecm signal is for the jet to align nw/se as the azores high pulls back towards newfoundland. the jet stays strong delivering systems into europe which have to pass across our part of nw europe. the track of these secondary lows will dictate where any snowfall ends up. not expecting anything of note before the 6th/7th.  there will have to some blocking to our north but i suspect it will be of the weak variety - weak but very effective. also possible tranisent amplified ridges between systems.


Originally Posted by: nickl 


Hi Nick and Merry Christmas


The ECM ensemble mean has been trending colder into the first week of the New year for several days now.  Initially beyond Day 10 there are two groupings, one with average temperatures and one with cold. By Days 14-15 the milder grouping just becomes scatter. The colder one gives highs of around 3C and overnight lows around -1/-2C.  Nothing very cold but certainly indicative of a change perhaps to colder zonality?


Another four bouts of rain showing up well, quite well supported by the Ensemble mean and very much in agreement with the GFS run.


So, another week to 10 days of zonality but gradually changing in nature as we head into the New Year.


 


Originally Posted by: Andy Woodcock 


and to you Gandy. the ecm extended ens have been singing a very consistent theme of troughing in two weeks time but, more importantly, also to our south. mean slp remains low towards iceland and the low anomoly around us keeps restoring so it appears to show a similar story to now (though with much less cyclogenesis) but depressions on a track around a mid atlantic high and dropping south through us.  that presents a very difficult scenario on the nwp as pinning down the track of the depressions will vary run to run and obviously deliver very different surface conditions across the uk.

pdiddy
25 December 2013 16:02:52




Merry Christmas anyone and a bit of seasonal joy from ECM.

The 240 chart is indeed loaded with potential, of particular interest is that we lose the warm uppers over Europe with the Russian high nosing westward at high latitude. Pressure rises across Greenland although this is a 'Retron' Greeny high which may be a surface illusion.

Also the next low coming out the states is on a very southerly track which will tend to strengthen the northern blocking pattern.

Just one run but on its own it's probably the best chart outside deep FI that we have seen in weeks.

Andy

Originally Posted by: nickl 


cant see that the ecm suite supports strong height rises to our north. ncep/gem has been playing with this. ecm much flatter. the  consistent ecm signal is for the jet to align nw/se as the azores high pulls back towards newfoundland. the jet stays strong delivering systems into europe which have to pass across our part of nw europe. the track of these secondary lows will dictate where any snowfall ends up. not expecting anything of note before the 6th/7th.  there will have to some blocking to our north but i suspect it will be of the weak variety - weak but very effective. also possible tranisent amplified ridges between systems.


Originally Posted by: Gandalf The White 


Hi Nick and Merry Christmas


The ECM ensemble mean has been trending colder into the first week of the New year for several days now.  Initially beyond Day 10 there are two groupings, one with average temperatures and one with cold. By Days 14-15 the milder grouping just becomes scatter. The colder one gives highs of around 3C and overnight lows around -1/-2C.  Nothing very cold but certainly indicative of a change perhaps to colder zonality?


Another four bouts of rain showing up well, quite well supported by the Ensemble mean and very much in agreement with the GFS run.


So, another week to 10 days of zonality but gradually changing in nature as we head into the New Year.


 


Originally Posted by: nickl 


and to you Gandy. the ecm extended ens have been singing a very consistent theme of troughing in two weeks time but, more importantly, also to our south. mean slp remains low towards iceland and the low anomoly around us keeps restoring so it appears to show a similar story to now (though with much less cyclogenesis) but depressions on a track around a mid atlantic high and dropping south through us.  that presents a very difficult scenario on the nwp as pinning down the track of the depressions will vary run to run and obviously deliver very different surface conditions across the uk.


Originally Posted by: Andy Woodcock 


Agreed.  that said, the GFS ensembles have been remarkably "tight" over the past fortnight and continue that trend giving reasonable confidemce, albeit trending colder:


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/MT8_Aberdeen_ens.png


 


 

Hungry Tiger
25 December 2013 16:09:58

10th January to bear in mind.


http://www.jp2webdesign.co.uk/ds/gfs.htm


Gavin S. FRmetS.
TWO Moderator.
Contact the TWO team - [email protected]
South Cambridgeshire. 93 metres or 302.25 feet ASL.


Rob K
25 December 2013 17:23:33
Evening all. Quite a fun chart from GFS 12Z. I didn't see the 06Z but assume this is a continuation of a trend?

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn3601.png 
Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl
"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome
The Beast from the East
25 December 2013 17:25:19

another interesting FI but it takes a hell of a long time to get there. High pressure over Europe again the problem


UKMO has Friday's storm further south than GFS


 


"We have some alternative facts for you"
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