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Quantum
14 January 2014 16:30:18

http://cdn.nwstatic.co.uk/gfsimages/gfs.20140114/12/177/h500slp.png


YES, the scandi high is splitting!


 


EDIT:Atlantic too strong, so transaction cannot be completed. We need southerly winds to stay over W greenland. However the fact that we are getting the scandi high split at all is extremely encouraging and offers the possibility of some real significant winter cold. 


Twitter: @QuantumOverlord (general), @MedicaneWatch (medicane/TC stuff)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
roger63
14 January 2014 16:30:34

http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/ukmo2.php?nh=0&ech=144&carte=1021


Ho on METO not pushing as far west as GFS but encouraging.

Russwirral
14 January 2014 16:39:01

Has all the hall marks of a model not dealing well with a Scandi high. That low at 192, seems to want to slide, and seems a little more amplified to head south, split jet (not a bad thing to feed the HP. I expect this to develop further. Very encouraging.


Experience tells me that if the Models wanted the Atlantic to storm through the signs would be a little more pronounced by now.


Rob K
14 January 2014 16:55:32
We end with a very "squashed" pattern as the jet forces through

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn3361.png 

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn3362.png 


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn2882.png 

Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl
"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome
Gooner
14 January 2014 17:49:34

http://www.meteociel.fr/ukmo/runs/2014011412/UN144-21.GIF?14-18


That isn't bad at all from UKMO


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Russwirral
14 January 2014 18:00:13
Just looking at the bigger picture there, at no point in all of the GFS run are Atlantic systems running up over Scandanavia. All are pushed south over France towards Italy. Energy being pushed south - promising.

The Beast from the East
14 January 2014 18:19:31

not such a good ECM with trough disruption. No easterly this time I think


"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
Stormchaser
14 January 2014 18:28:00


The long term signal for a block somewhere to our NE remains this morning.


While it's looking like a case of 'close but no cigar' in the next 10 days, ECM shows LP on the slide again on day 10 and with an amplifying pattern upstream that could generate a ridge over the top of our slider, then enticing the Russia/Scandi block westward.


Originally Posted by: Stormchaser 


 


Well, GFS just got the cigar out, and so did UKMO!


Still not close enough on GFS, but UKMO looks decent thanks to much less troughing above the Scandi High, with quite high heights getting to Svalbard. In fact, I daresday it looks very good indeed!


We're once again seeing hints of the mid-Atlantic ridge enticing the Scandi block west, except that it's more of an Azores Ridge as the GFS and UKMO output stands.


If that bit of residual energy would just slip nicely SE, or at least pull out NW... 


I know that any initial easterly isn't looking like anything special, but if we could get that block level with Svalbard, then the potential arises for swinging some new cold through the continent and towards our shores.


 


ECM rolling out... looking decent for WAA but as TBFTE just pointed out, the trough disruption is not nearly as good.


We could still get somewhere with that bit of energy dropping south, though... waiting and wondering.


If you have any problems or queries relating to TWO you can Email [email protected]

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2023's Homeland Extremes:
T-Max: 30.2°C 9th Sep (...!) | T-Min: -7.1°C 22nd & 23rd Jan | Wettest Day: 25.9mm 2nd Nov | Ice Days: 1 (2nd Dec -1.3°C in freezing fog)
Keep Calm and Forecast On
The Beast from the East
14 January 2014 18:30:28

ironically ECM most progressive of the big 3 having led the way!


 


"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
SEMerc
14 January 2014 18:36:05


http://www.meteociel.fr/ukmo/runs/2014011412/UN144-21.GIF?14-18


That isn't bad at all from UKMO


Originally Posted by: Gooner 


Just wait until that low blasts through.

SEMerc
14 January 2014 18:38:05



The long term signal for a block somewhere to our NE remains this morning.


While it's looking like a case of 'close but no cigar' in the next 10 days, ECM shows LP on the slide again on day 10 and with an amplifying pattern upstream that could generate a ridge over the top of our slider, then enticing the Russia/Scandi block westward.


Originally Posted by: Stormchaser 


 


Well, GFS just got the cigar out, and so did UKMO!


Still not close enough on GFS, but UKMO looks decent thanks to much less troughing above the Scandi High, with quite high heights getting to Svalbard. In fact, I daresday it looks very good indeed!


We're once again seeing hints of the mid-Atlantic ridge enticing the Scandi block west, except that it's more of an Azores Ridge as the GFS and UKMO output stands.


If that bit of residual energy would just slip nicely SE, or at least pull out NW... 


I know that any initial easterly isn't looking like anything special, but if we could get that block level with Svalbard, then the potential arises for swinging some new cold through the continent and towards our shores.


 


ECM rolling out... looking decent for WAA but as TBFTE just pointed out, the trough disruption is not nearly as good.


We could still get somewhere with that bit of energy dropping south, though... waiting and wondering.


Originally Posted by: Stormchaser 


It's like a woman taking her bra off, only to reveal another bra.

bledur
14 January 2014 18:43:16

It's like a woman taking her bra off, only to reveal another bra.


 oh dont remind meLOL

David M Porter
14 January 2014 18:46:15

On topic please folks.


Lenzie, Glasgow

"Let us not take ourselves too seriously. None of us has a monopoly on wisdom, and we must always be ready to listen and respect other points of view."- Queen Elizabeth II 1926-2022
Gooner
14 January 2014 18:54:27

http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/ecmwf/runs/2014011412/ECH1-216.GIF?14-0


NWlies for the UK


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


SEMerc
14 January 2014 18:57:15

Good finish to the ECM. You can see the Scandi high edging in by about T+1600.

DEW
  • DEW
  • Advanced Member
14 January 2014 19:18:01


Good finish to the ECM. You can see the Scandi high edging in by about T+1600.


Originally Posted by: SEMerc 


T +1600 is about 2 months off. Sounds about right for this year's Scandi High!


War does not determine who is right, only who is left - Bertrand Russell

Chichester 12m asl
Gooner
14 January 2014 19:19:51


Good finish to the ECM. You can see the Scandi high edging in by about T+1600.


Originally Posted by: SEMerc 



Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


jondg14
14 January 2014 19:31:22

Good finish to the ECM. You can see the Scandi high edging in by about T+1600.

Originally Posted by: SEMerc 



😁 A Scandi snail!

At least it's better than the Euro slug.
Arbroath 1320
14 January 2014 19:50:51
1 step forward and 2 steps back it seems for coldies.

There's no doubt the models are struggling in projecting the orientation and movement of the low pressure system coming off the Atlantic. I suspect we'll see some more chopping and changing from the models in the short-term. Could go either way still in terms of getting an Easterly over the next week or so but the Azores High remains stubbornly persistent across models and may well scupper things.
GGTTH
Whether Idle
14 January 2014 19:57:00


ironically ECM most progressive of the big 3 having led the way!


 


Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


Typical capriciousness from the Euro.


Meanwhile UKMO 144 is known for its proclivity for pointed change from run to run.


GEFS are indicative of a cooler period while we temporarily come under the influence of the "poor man's easterly".


Edit - more support for UKMO - from the Chinese!:


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/cmae_cartes.php?&ech=144&mode=0&carte=0


Dover, 5m asl. Half a mile from the south coast.
Hippydave
14 January 2014 20:47:54

A step towards a cooler solution from GFS whilst ECM steps back a bit. Tis good consistency


I suspect looking back at this period on the verification stats and they'll be a noticeable dip whilst the models are getting a handle on how much energy to throw at the block and how much of said energy goes over, under or dies in situ.


Could either be an interesting if slow crawl to a cold end to the month or a slow tedious stumble back to zonality.


I do like the fact the GFS op has a few friends with it on the colder path:


http://www.theweatheroutlook.com/charts/gefs/gefsens850London0.png


There's a small cooler/cold cluster on the 2m temps too (haven't got a link for them ones) - be interesting to see what the ECM ens show.


Also worth mentioning the GEM run I guess which really isn't having any of it and keeps the Scandi HP well away from us (comparatively). Tends to have more noticeable dips than the 'big 3' imo but verifies well and probably better than GFS if it's not on one of its lost the plot runs.


Home: Tunbridge Wells
Work: Tonbridge
GIBBY
14 January 2014 20:48:55

Good evening. Here is the report on the 12 midday outputs from GFS, UKMO, GEM, NAVGEM and ECM for tonight Tuesday January 14th 2014 taken from http://www.norton-radstockweather.co.uk/Model-Analysis(2859336).htm


All models show a warm front crossing the UK as I type with rain spilling East across the UK in rapidly turning milder weather. The South then becomes drizzly later in the night and at first tomorrow while the North sees the early night rain and hill snow continue throughout with any snow turning back to rain. Tomorrow shows a cold front moving East over the UK with showery rain as it goes clearing to showers in the West later. The rest of the week and weekend is typified by the close proximity of Low pressure with showers or longer spells of rain, heavy in places with some drier and brighter spells as well most likely towards the East and NE.


GFS then shows next week with colder weather making it's way across the UK from the East briefly with the threat of some wintry showers for a time as Low pressure fills it's way SE over France. It isn't long before the pattern reverts to form with Atlantic wind and rain on fronts crossing East in association with depressions to the North takes hold once more. Throughout the run apart from the brief colder interlude early next week temperatures will remain close to average with a rather chilly and strong breeze at times.


The GFS Ensembles reflect the operational run quite well tonight with unsettled and changeable weather expected for all areas through most of the time. A brief colder interlude is shown within the ensembles too early next week though most members that support this go the way of returning milder air back soon afterwards.


UKMO closes it's run with filling Low pressure sliding SE across the UK and on over Europe leaving very slack conditions across the UK with a legacy of cloud and patchy rain or even sleet in places as things turn rather colder.


GEM shows a ridge of High pressure building NE towards Southern Britain early next week with early week rain clearing to a drier and brighter phase in the South for a time. Later the weather returns changeable and wet at times again as further fronts and attendant Low pressure moves East to the North of the UK. By the end of the run winds have swung NW with sunshine and showers, wintry in the North.


NAVGEM shows a similar trend to GEM but develops the ridge less and further South meaning the path to continued Atlantic dominated weather over the UK is easier with further Low pressure areas crossing East over or to the North of the UK with rain and showers at times in average temperatures.


ECM shows largely changeable weather continuing next week. A drier interlude looks likely under a weak ridge at the start of the week before further Atlantic Low pressure continues to deliver rain at times in very average overall conditions for January though it could turn rather colder at times later next week.


The ECM 9 and 10 Day Mean Charts look very similar to this morning with a trough strecthing SE down the East of the Uk from Low pressure to the NW and SE and High well to the SW and NE. Scrolling between the two days shows little overall change with the Azores High notably strong.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Reem2161.gif
http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Reem2401.gif


The Jet Stream continues to flow to the South of the UK and Southern Europe over the coming week. Later in the output it appears that the flow may strengthen while moving across the Atlantic into the UK before once more progressing into Southern Europe.


In Summary tonight the indecision remains with regard to specific weather detail next week as approaching Atlantic depressions split with one portion sending energy NE while some energy moves SE across the UK with resultant slack pressure at times under Low pressure. As is alwas the case under these synoptics weather details are always hard to pin down with some rain and showers inevitable with some snow on Northern hills while other areas see dry and bright weather at times too. There is still some hope that something might develop from the East should more energy spill SE from these depressions than is currently shown but with the Atlantic remaining strong and some indication of a Jet flow strengthening later next week the favourite option remains for unsettled and Atlantic based weather to continue to run the show over the British Isles for the time being.


Martin G
Kilmersdon Radstock Bath Somerset



Look up my New Facebook Weather Page  for all the latest up to the minute weather stories as they happen
White Meadows
14 January 2014 21:37:43
Can't remember the last time ukmo showed an easterly at 144hrs.
Let's hope the jet plays ball.
Rob K
14 January 2014 22:16:03

18Z GFS looks to have a much less favourable angle of the trough and a much deeper low over Canada


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn1261.png


 


Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl
"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome
Quantum
14 January 2014 22:23:00

18Z is only slightly worse than the 12Z tbh, its just so finelly balanced it doesn't take much to push it over the other way. But tbh the odds are strongly in favour of the pest from the west winning over the beast from the east atm. ECM0Z to save the day? Perhaps, perhaps not?


 


Twitter: @QuantumOverlord (general), @MedicaneWatch (medicane/TC stuff)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
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