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Quantum
  • Quantum
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
22 January 2014 02:11:33

Think its time for one of these threads. Ive been very generous with the bounds here, but I think its necessary to cover most reasonable possibilities. There is a small (say 10%) chance of snow even to lower levels tommorow if any cold air can advect from the north sea, before the band of precipatation clears. Thursday sees some polar maritime air mixing into our low, and precipatation on occluded fronts could again turn to snow, possibly more likely this time but still marginal. The friday to saturday period doesn't currently suggest anything in the way of snow, but I include it because of the nature of the frontal system. We have a strong ana warm front with southerly winds on its leading edge;it would not take much of an upgrade even now to make it cold enough to produce snow on its leading edge given that the cold air will only be half way across the north sea by then. 


And now some rough snow checking bench marks:


850hpa temperature:


-3C: Strong ana warm front or evaporational cooling event 


-4C: Well defined warm occlusion


-6C: Showers, cold occlusion or kata warm front


-7C: Cold front


-8C: Warm sector precipatation


500-1000mb thickness:


Roughly 534dam for Strong warm front, otherwise closer to 526dm. Highly variable. 


850-1000mb thickness:


129.5dm is usually an excellent benchmark for wintryness. <129dm would be almost definately snow.  


In evap cooling event may rise to 130dm.


Dewpoints:


Snow very unlikely if d.p >1.5C. Good benchmark is 0C in general.


2m temp


If the 2m temp is 0.0C or lower, check 925mb temp; if this is significantly above 0C expect rain or freezing rain.


If the 925mb is around 0C then ice pellets, freezing rain or snow.


if 925mb is below 0C then snow.


If 2m temp is above 0C then very rough benchmarks:


1.5C: Frontal based precipatation


3C: Showers that come from the north sea


5C: Showers from a strong NWerly wind in winter


8C: Showers from a strong NWerly wind in spring


Soundings


Provided by the GFS and WRF from meteociel or weatheronline.co.uk. Limited range and accuracy but more obvious whether rain or snow likely from size of warm layer.  


 


 


 


Twitter: @QuantumOverlord (general), @MedicaneWatch (medicane/TC stuff)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
Andy Woodcock
22 January 2014 08:23:46
Hmmm, really not sure such limited prospects deserve a snow potential thread but with nothing else to look at in the charts this morning we might as well give it a go.

Most of the uk is in sub 528 air on Thursday so could get a few wintry showers up north.

Andy
Andy Woodcock
Penrith
Cumbria

Altitude 535 feet

"Why are the British so worried about climate change? Any change to their climate can only be an improvement" John Daley 2001
Matty H
22 January 2014 08:38:33
Here's the MetO's take on it:


Thursday:

Heavy showery rain, with hill snow, will move eastwards across the UK through the morning. Scattered showers follow into the north and west, otherwise largely dry and bright.

Updated: 0316 on Wed 22 Jan 2014




And:


Outlook for Friday to Sunday:

Becoming wet and windy on Friday. Rain clearing to bright spells and blustery showers on Saturday, some wintry in the north. Turning wet and windy again on Sunday.

Updated: 0316 on Wed 22 Jan 2014





idj20
22 January 2014 08:48:13

And to be honest, it is a bit hard to get that excited about this one when 1) it'll all be mostly high ground marginal stuff (cold rain for my locaton) and 2) another round of strong to gale force winds and heavy rain will come sweeping in from the Atlantic to shift all that in a blink of an eye.

But, hey, a change is as good as the rest, I guess. 


Folkestone Harbour. 
NickR
22 January 2014 08:54:32
This might be the best chance we get all winter.
Nick
Durham
[email protected]
Arcus
22 January 2014 14:33:18
The only people likely to see any snow worth talking about over the next few days will be in upland areas on the Pennines, Cumbrian Fells, or Scottish mountains. There may be some hail or sleet in the heavier showers in some lowland areas to the N and W, but that's about it.
Ben,
Nr. Easingwold, North Yorkshire
30m asl
Rob K
22 January 2014 15:17:46

This might be the best chance we get all winter.

Originally Posted by: NickR 


Might be, but considering we have only had 58% of the winter, there's a good chance it won't be.


 


There seems to be a perception on here that we are on the home straight of winter - I sometimes wonder if I haven't overslept and woken up on February 22nd, not January 22nd!


Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl
"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome
DEW
  • DEW
  • Advanced Member
22 January 2014 18:08:01

This thread started a bit early for lowland Britain?


0-3 days i.e. 22nd onwards, highland areas only


http://www.snow-forecast.com/maps/static/uk/next3days/snow


3-6 days, i.e. 25th onwards, and the snow spreads as far south as the Chilterns


http://www.snow-forecast.com/maps/static/uk/next3to6days/snow


 


War does not determine who is right, only who is left - Bertrand Russell

Chichester 12m asl
doctormog
22 January 2014 18:28:36
John Hammond suggested that tomorrow morning could see "snow or wintry showers down to quite low levels" in the north.

I'm not expecting to see anything here at all as it is just too low but areas above as low as maybe 200m could see snow tomorrow IMO.
Matty H
22 January 2014 20:46:03
Latest from the MetO. Nasty:


This Evening and Tonight:

Mostly dry inland with clear spells, patchy frost and isolated fog patches. A band of heavy, squally showers will move across northwestern parts of the UK after midnight, perhaps giving hail, thunder and hill snow. Icy patches may follow here.

Thursday:

Heavy showery rain, with hill snow, will move eastwards across the UK through the morning. Sunshine and showers will follow, particularly across the north and west. Breezy and feeling cold.

Updated: 1435 on Wed 22 Jan 2014





And:


Outlook for Friday to Sunday:

Becoming wet and windy on Friday. Rain clearing to bright spells and blustery showers on Saturday, some wintry in the north. Heavy rain and gales spreading eastwards on Sunday.

Updated: 1435 on Wed 22 Jan 2014


roger63
23 January 2014 09:29:44

Would it be worthwhile extending  the  snow potential thread to cover next week  which does seem to have greater potentila than this week.

The Beast from the East
23 January 2014 11:13:30


Would it be worthwhile extending  the  snow potential thread to cover next week  which does seem to have greater potentila than this week.


Originally Posted by: roger63 


Ferguson saying METO are only concerned about snow for Scotland and NE England for Wednesday. Then a return to zonal most likely as we have seen from the the publicly available output. MOGREPS only have 10% chance of an easterly later


So the coming period will be zonal but cold zonal and a good test to see if it delivers anything wintry away from the favoured locations.


"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
Russwirral
23 January 2014 14:35:56

further my post before


 


here is some Snow porn


 


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-21910737


 


Mold received around 90cms in one night.  This area isnt on high ground situated around 100m asl.


 


Magical things can happen quite late in the season.


LeedsLad123
23 January 2014 16:20:18
We just had a moderate snow shower for a few minutes. Better than nothing I suppose.
Whitkirk, Leeds - 85m ASL.
Tim A
23 January 2014 17:09:43
Best snow of the winter!
The smallest of all dustings and icy now....
Tim
NW Leeds
187m asl

 My PWS 
snow 2004
23 January 2014 18:05:35

Left work to rain, which turned to hail and then snow. Some really quite big flakes and heavy snow near home for a time. Took a detour over the hill a couple of miles from my house. Snow is on cars down to around 230 metres. The snow started on the road at 270 -300 metres with a full covering and a temp of 0c. At 400 metres (the top of the hill) there was a full light covering on all surfaces. Can't be too clever on the Snake summit now


Glossop Derbyshire, 200m asl
Retron
23 January 2014 18:21:19

Just had a hail shower which, as it eased off in intensity, turned into a mixture of big fluffy flakes of snow mixed with raindrops - the first snowflakes I've seen this winter!

Before it started the air temperature was +5.6C, dew -3C. It's now +4.3C, dew -4.2C (according to my station, which does tend to report dewpoints a couple of degrees below the actual).

Here's a pic during the hail phase:


Leysdown, north Kent
Andy Woodcock
23 January 2014 18:49:38
Snow lying on the Lake District Fells down to about 1000feet following a heavy fall of snow above this level this morning.

Was just cold rain in penrith although you could see sleet on the car windscreen.

The weather is feeling much more seasonal now with near average temps but with all the cloud and rain it's still bloody miserable.

The models keep promising cold zonality but it never turns up, a big like the ghost easterlies.

Andy
Andy Woodcock
Penrith
Cumbria

Altitude 535 feet

"Why are the British so worried about climate change? Any change to their climate can only be an improvement" John Daley 2001
Whether Idle
23 January 2014 18:49:46
Wet snow in the mix here. Wintry shower at Whifield nr Dover 400ft asl
Dover, 5m asl. Half a mile from the south coast.
Medlock Vale Weather
23 January 2014 18:55:05

Had some heavy snow earlier, most of it was wet, however we had some small deposits on the car. Winter finally arrives!


Alan in Medlock Valley - Oldham's frost hollow. 103 metres above sea level.
What is a frost hollow? http://www.weatheronline.co.uk/reports/wxfacts/Frost-hollow.htm 
Gusty
23 January 2014 20:12:49

Observed a sleety hail shower just after 6pm here. My waiting to see an actual snowflake this winter continues...hopefully by this time next week that wait will be over. 


Steve - Folkestone, Kent
Current conditions from my Davis Vantage Vue
https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/IFOLKE11 
Join Kent Weather on Facebook.
https://www.facebook.com/stevewall69/ 



ChrisJG
23 January 2014 22:57:35
Endured a very heavy snow and hail storm on the M6 earlier this evening by the Charnock Richard services. The motorway was completely covered at one stage. It went so dark and there were flashes of lightening as it dropped a good inch of 'white stuff' in no time. Made for horrendous driving for 20 minutes or so. Good to see some snow tho!
Home - near Penrith 150m ASL
Work - North/Central Cumbria
Andy Woodcock
24 January 2014 08:12:06
Covering of snow in Huddersfield yesterday evening.

None of this wintry activity in Northern England seems to have been forecasted by the MetO with many reports of lying snow below 100meters.

Andy
Andy Woodcock
Penrith
Cumbria

Altitude 535 feet

"Why are the British so worried about climate change? Any change to their climate can only be an improvement" John Daley 2001
Twister
24 January 2014 13:29:23

I also saw a sleety mix in a heavy shower early yesterday evening. The question is... is that my snow lot for the season?


Location: Egerton, Kent - 33m ASL
Thunder 2016: 12 (Apr 3,13; May 21; Jun 8,11,17,22,23,25, Jul 2,12, Aug 26)
Winter 2015/6: Snowfalls: 10 | Snowcover: 2 (Jan 17 (0.5cm)) | Air frosts: 39
Winter 2016/7: Snowfalls: 4 (Jan 12-3, Feb 10-11) | Snowcover: 2 (Jan 13, 2cm, Feb 11, 3-5mm) | Air frosts: 57 (2 in Oct, 10 in Nov, 13 in Dec, 19 in Jan, 6 in Feb, 3 in Mar, 4 in Apr)
"The heavens tell of the glory of God. The skies display his marvellous craftsmanship." (Psalm 19:1)
Andy Woodcock
26 January 2014 01:36:56
Rain turned to sleet and snow for a while this afternoon with a temperature around 2.8c

Ok it's not much but in winter 2013/14 anything is better than nothing.

Andy
Andy Woodcock
Penrith
Cumbria

Altitude 535 feet

"Why are the British so worried about climate change? Any change to their climate can only be an improvement" John Daley 2001
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