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Bugglesgate
27 March 2020 21:54:05


 


I would start by closing down more of the economy. Non-essential construction is an obvious thing to stop. After seeing Berko high street last Saturday I would also stop open air markets because it's more difficult to control the number of people.   


In addition the government advice is:


You should work from home unless it is impossible for you to do so.


Sometimes this will not be possible, as not everyone can work from home. Certain jobs require people to travel to their place of work – for instance if you operate machinery, work in construction or manufacturing, or are delivering front line services.


I would change it to:


You should work from home unless you are a key worker. If work from home is not possible and your business is not considered essential it  must shut. 


Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 


 


Our place, being a Govt institution,  seems to have pre-empted  most of the Govts moves by a few days all along the line.  I am a Key  Worker  and I  was issued with a covering letter and instructions to present it with my pass  badge if I was stopped  when trying to get into work (I am working at home at the moment, but could be called in for technical support at a short notice)  AFAIK  people aren't being  challenged in that way now, so the question is, what's  in the pipeline in the next few days - could be genuine  movement restrictions are in the offing  ?


Chris (It,its)
Between Newbury and Basingstoke
"When they are giving you their all, some stagger and fall, after all it's not easy banging your heart against some mad buggers wall"
RobN
  • RobN
  • Advanced Member
27 March 2020 21:59:15

Millions of non-essential workers going to work? Personally I have to say I don’t know of any. A small sample I know.

What are the odds that those delivery drivers, bus drivers, bin collectors, street cleaners, policemen, firemen, NHS workers, care staff, supermarket workers not to mention those I have forgotten do not amount to the majority of those millions going to work?

Originally Posted by: doctormog 


It takes a lot of people to be at work just for society to function even at the most basic level.


Rob
In the flatlands of South Cambridgeshire 15m ASL.
Lionel Hutz
27 March 2020 22:00:57


 


I would start by closing down more of the economy. Non-essential construction is an obvious thing to stop. After seeing Berko high street last Saturday I would also stop open air markets because it's more difficult to control the number of people.   


In addition the government advice is:


You should work from home unless it is impossible for you to do so.


Sometimes this will not be possible, as not everyone can work from home. Certain jobs require people to travel to their place of work – for instance if you operate machinery, work in construction or manufacturing, or are delivering front line services.


I would change it to:


You should work from home unless you are a key worker. If work from home is not possible and your business is not considered essential it  must shut. 


Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 


Well, you should come to Ireland, so. Leo has just announced that all non essential businesses must close for two weeks. Not sure if my business is included as essential, probably not. Not the end of the world if it's for the programmed 2 week period. 


Interestingly, you are only allowed to travel for a maximum of 2km for exercise purposes. To be fair, that gives clarity. Mrs. Hutz had planned a trip to the beach tomorrow. That's off the cards now, obviously. To be honest, I'm perfectly happy with that. We have a nice wood beside us. A picnic there tomorrow in the sun and sheltered from the breeze sounds like heaven to me!


 


Lionel Hutz
Nr.Waterford , S E Ireland
68m ASL



DEW
  • DEW
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
27 March 2020 22:01:30

Firemen called out to Winter Hill near Bolton today - moorland fire thought to have been ignited by several barbecues; and how did they get there?


War does not determine who is right, only who is left - Bertrand Russell

Chichester 12m asl
DEW
  • DEW
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
27 March 2020 22:05:10


 


It hasn’t been too bad here. Although people don’t seem to like doing the “single file” thing. It’s annoying as I always make the effort to take a wide birth from people. 


I’ve run/walked past the odd person at perhaps a distance of a metre or so, usually at a fair speed. Even if they were positive for COVID-19 I’d hope this would be low risk. I even hold my breath I’m that paranoid!


Originally Posted by: Joe Bloggs 


I didn't know you were a gynecologist:)


 


War does not determine who is right, only who is left - Bertrand Russell

Chichester 12m asl
Saint Snow
27 March 2020 22:05:49

My missus is still part of a messenger group, comprised of about 20 mums of kids in our youngest's primary school. She got the following this evening:


 


Good morning All,


I’ve been sent this information which may be useful, it has been sent to NHS staff...


From my sister in law who works At The Princess of Wales hospital.


NHS staff have been sent this:


This is the advice given to hospital staff.
It explains the virus and hopefully, how to prevent getting it.
Please share with family, friends and work colleagues.


Virus Detection:


The simplest way to distinguish Coronavirus from a Common Cold is that the COVID-19 infection does not cause a cold nose or cough with cold, but it does create a dry and rough cough.
The virus is typically first installed in the throat causing inflammation and a feeling of dryness. This symptom can last between 3 and 4 days.
The virus typically then travels through the moisture present in the airways, goes down to the trachea and installs in the lungs, causing pneumonia that lasts about 5 or 6 days.
Pneumonia manifests with a high fever and difficulty breathing. The Common Cold is not accompanied, but there may be a choking sensation. In this case, the doctor should be called immediately.


Experts suggest doing this simple verification every morning: Breathe in deeply and hold your breath for 10 seconds. If this can be done without coughing, without difficulty, this shows that there is no fibrosis in the lungs, indicating the absence of infection. It is recommended to do this control every morning to help detect infection.


Prevention:
The virus hates heat and dies if it is exposed to temperatures greater than 80°F (27°C). Therefore hot drinks such as infusions, broths or simply hot water should be consumed abundantly during the day. These hot liquids kill the virus and are easy to ingest.
Avoid drinking ice water or drinks with ice cubes.


Ensure that your mouth and throat are always wet, never DRY. You should drink a sip of water at least every 15 minutes. WHY? Even when the virus enters water or other liquids through the mouth, it will get flushed through the oesophagus directly into the stomach where gastric acids destroy the virus. If there is not enough water, the virus can pass into the trachea and from there to the lungs, where it is very dangerous.


For those who can, sunbathe. The Sun's UV rays kill the virus and the vitamin D is good for you.
The Coronavirus has a large size (diameter of 400-500 nanometers) so face masks can stop it, no special face masks are needed in daily life.
If an infected person sneezes nearby, stay 10 feet (3.3 meters) away to allow the virus fall to the ground and prevent it from falling on you.
When the virus is on hard surfaces, it survives about 12 hours, therefore when hard surfaces such as doors, appliances, railings, etc. are touched, hands should be washed thoroughly and/or disinfected with alcoholic gel The virus can live nested in clothes and tissues between 6 and 12 hours. Common detergents can kill it. Things that cannot be washed should be exposed to the Sun and the virus will die.
The transmission of the virus usually occurs by direct infection, touching fabrics, tissues or materials on which the virus is present.
Washing your hands is essential.
The virus survives on our hands for only about 10 minutes. In that time many things can happen, rubbing the eyes, touching the nose or lips. This allows the virus to enter your throat. Therefore, for your good and the good of all, wash your hands very often and disinfect them.
You can gargle with disinfectant solutions (i.e. Listerine or Hydrogen Peroxide) that eliminate or minimize the amount of virus that can enter the throat. Doing so removes the virus before it goes down to the trachea and then to the lungs.
Disinfect things touched often: mobile phone, keyboard, mouse, car steering wheel, door handles, etc ....


Sent in to us just now and we wanted to share this knowledge & advice with you all.


Please do the same and take care!


 


FFS. My missus is 'NHS staff' and that really hasn't been sent out.


Nor would it be. Because despite a few bits being factual, most of it is utter crap. It's a collection of urban myths, rumours, pure bunkum, and the fertile imagination of the writer.


I envisage the writer being some narcissistic half-wit who gets a thrill from people reading their garbage.


 


Sadly, about half the group have liked it 


No wonder this country voted Brexit.



Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
Bugglesgate
27 March 2020 22:08:30


 


Well, you should come to Ireland, so. Leo has just announced that all non essential businesses must close for two weeks. Not sure if my business is included as essential, probably not. Not the end of the world if it's for the programmed 2 week period. 


Interestingly, you are only allowed to travel for a maximum of 2km for exercise purposes. To be fair, that gives clarity. Mrs. Hutz had planned a trip to the beach tomorrow. That's off the cards now, obviously. To be honest, I'm perfectly happy with that. We have a nice wood beside us. A picnic there tomorrow in the sun and sheltered from the breeze sounds like heaven to me!


 


Originally Posted by: Lionel Hutz 


 


I'm lucky, I just have to walk out the back of the estate into open countryside,   but   the 2KM rule would certainly prevent loads of City folk from reaching open countryside.   Given gyms are closed and some parks I've no idea how that would work


Chris (It,its)
Between Newbury and Basingstoke
"When they are giving you their all, some stagger and fall, after all it's not easy banging your heart against some mad buggers wall"
John p
27 March 2020 22:11:57


FFS. My missus is 'NHS staff' and that really hasn't been sent out.


Nor would it be. Because despite a few bits being factual, most of it is utter crap. It's a collection of urban myths, rumours, pure bunkum, and the fertile imagination of the writer.


I envisage the writer being some narcissistic half-wit who gets a thrill from people reading their garbage.


 


Sadly, about half the group have liked it 


No wonder this country voted Brexit.


Originally Posted by: Saint Snow 


 


I’m just off for a cup of tea.


Camberley, Surrey
JHutch
27 March 2020 22:15:20


My missus is still part of a messenger group, comprised of about 20 mums of kids in our youngest's primary school. She got the following this evening:


 


 


Prevention:
The virus hates heat and dies if it is exposed to temperatures greater than 80°F (27°C). Therefore hot drinks such as infusions, broths or simply hot water should be consumed abundantly during the day. These hot liquids kill the virus and are easy to ingest.


 


FFS. My missus is 'NHS staff' and that really hasn't been sent out.


Nor would it be. Because despite a few bits being factual, most of it is utter crap. It's a collection of urban myths, rumours, pure bunkum, and the fertile imagination of the writer.


I envisage the writer being some narcissistic half-wit who gets a thrill from people reading their garbage.


 


Sadly, about half the group have liked it 


No wonder this country voted Brexit.


Originally Posted by: Saint Snow 


Have seen a lot of medics saw its wrong and thought you may have fallen for it until I saw what you had written at the bottom. Lines I have left in in particular should provoke some queries - the human body has a temperature of about 37C so if temperatures above 27C killed it then I doubt we would be in this predicament.


FWIW, some parts of it are true but it is still misleading.

Bugglesgate
27 March 2020 22:15:32


 


 


I’m just off for a cup of tea.


Originally Posted by: John p 


 


We're fine then-  Brits drink loads of tea - unlike the coffee swillin'  It'ies


(racial stereotype 49b/c34)


Chris (It,its)
Between Newbury and Basingstoke
"When they are giving you their all, some stagger and fall, after all it's not easy banging your heart against some mad buggers wall"
Lionel Hutz
27 March 2020 22:19:49


 


 


I'm lucky, I just have to walk out the back of the estate into open countryside,   but   the 2KM rule woudl certainly prevent loads of City folk from reaching open countryside.   Given gyms are closed and some parks I've no idea how that would work


Originally Posted by: Bugglesgate 


Yes, I do wonder whether the 2km rule may be a bit too prescriptive. Plus, I do think that we are well behind you in terms of infection rates so perhaps we don't need to go as far as we are going.However, hopefully it's a matter of a short sharp shock. Do it right and we will get it under control more quickly. 


I will have to break the new rules and arrange an emergency meeting in the morning(properly socially distanced) to decide what to do. I'm waiting to see whether solicitors are on the list of essential services. Doubt very much that we are but you never know. We will need to make decisions about lay offs if not.


Lionel Hutz
Nr.Waterford , S E Ireland
68m ASL



Bugglesgate
27 March 2020 22:25:02



 


Sadly, about half the group have liked it 


No wonder this country voted Brexit.


Originally Posted by: Saint Snow 


 


Ahem


 



 


 


 


Chris (It,its)
Between Newbury and Basingstoke
"When they are giving you their all, some stagger and fall, after all it's not easy banging your heart against some mad buggers wall"
Rob K
27 March 2020 22:36:28

Millions of non-essential workers going to work? Personally I have to say I don’t know of any. A small sample I know.

What are the odds that those delivery drivers, bus drivers, bin collectors, street cleaners, policemen, firemen, NHS workers, care staff, supermarket workers not to mention those I have forgotten do not amount to the majority of those millions going to work?

Originally Posted by: doctormog 


I know a fair few engineers and they are still having to work. Also people who work for garages, and one friend who delivers skips to those oh so essential building sites!


 


Meanwhile my daughter was complaining of chills and a severe headache this evening. The thermometer didn’t show a fever but I’m pretty sure the digital thermometer we have is useless. Bring back the old glass and mercury one my mum used to have!


Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl
"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome
Gavin D
27 March 2020 22:38:35
Chloe Middleton: death of 21-year-old not recorded as Covid-19

"The death of 21-year-old Chloe Middleton – the UK’s youngest coronavirus victim, her family believe – has not been recorded in the official toll because of confusion about how she died, the Guardian can reveal.

Middleton was taken to Wexham Park hospital in Slough last Thursday after having a heart attack. Attempts to resuscitate her failed and she was pronounced dead soon after arriving, a source said.

A Berkshire coroner said the death was related to Covid-19 after being told Middleton had a cough, the source said. But this surprised medics at the hospital, who have not recorded it as a coronavirus incident.

As a result of the hospital’s view, the death has not been recorded among the NHS tally of UK coronavirus fatalities.

A Facebook post by Middleton’s aunt claiming she had no underlying health issues has since been deleted. Her family has been subjected to online abuse and accusations of spreading alarmist news about her death."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/27/chloe-middleton-death-21-year-old-not-recorded-nhs-covid-19-related 
Rob K
27 March 2020 22:44:59


People STILL aren't taking this seriously !


Normally I go for my "Boris perambulation" very early or late and rarely see anyone.   Today I took off at 2.PM  and probably got a more realistic view of what is going on in my small part of the world (village /  mainly rural walk).


First I encountered "loves young dream" couple  hand in hand - had to jump into the hedge to avoid the daft bint -  no way were they going to go single file. They obviously couldn't give a "monkeys" !  


Then I encountered  the "old crone" with dog around the back of  Toad Hall (the local Banksters house) narrow path- 0.05 MPH with no passing place - did she step aside  when she could to let me pass with 2M- no,  she beckoned for me to pass her with 2" to spare and got annoyed when I refused to go pass and  scrupulously maintained my 2M   Given her age I could well be responsible for killing her if I pushed by and happened to be carrying it.


Finally, along the back field  of the estate it was like f'king  Butlins. amusement park  dogs, kids, balls and   parents all running about in groups and intermingling. 


I gave up at that point and diverted from my route.


There really is no bloody hope- a reasonable slice of people in this country give every impression of being congenital idiots


Not sure what the Govt. can do  except shoot a few of the b'stards as an example  maybe


 


Originally Posted by: Bugglesgate 


Certainly not what I have experienced. I’ve gone out for a bike ride the past three days and seen very few people out. Those who have been out jogging, cycling or dog walking have almost without exception gone out of their way to maintain distance. 


Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl
"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome
Bugglesgate
27 March 2020 22:54:27


 


Certainly not what I have experienced. I’ve gone out for a bike ride the past three days and seen very few people out. Those who have been out jogging, cycling or dog walking have almost without exception gone out of their way to maintain distance. 


Originally Posted by: Rob K 


We must just have a pocket of idiots living  round here then. 


I  just had an email from my mate  whose currently billeted at the other end of the village looking after his elderly mum and he's also encountered  groups of people  not complying with the  2M rule.  It's especially important for him not to bring the ruddy thing back to his Mum


I'm going to take some piccys if I see anything like that out of control group of kids and dogs again and email them to someone in authority .


 


 


Chris (It,its)
Between Newbury and Basingstoke
"When they are giving you their all, some stagger and fall, after all it's not easy banging your heart against some mad buggers wall"
Maunder Minimum
27 March 2020 22:55:08
Just watching "lessons learned" on Newsnight, but no mention of the true lessons to be learned. Here is my list:

1. When a novel virus breaks out in January, take note immediately and take action. Start ordering PPE for health staff and carers. Start ordering whatever looks like it will be required - in this case, ventilators and compressed oxygen.
2. As other places start to show signs of infection, enforce mandatory and monitored quarantine for everyone coming from such regions, whether citizen or foreigner.
3. Tell your own citizens to cancel their foreign holidays and assure them that if they still travel,it is entirely at their own risk.

New world order coming.
Gandalf The White
27 March 2020 22:56:52


My missus is still part of a messenger group, comprised of about 20 mums of kids in our youngest's primary school. She got the following this evening:


 


 


FFS. My missus is 'NHS staff' and that really hasn't been sent out.


Nor would it be. Because despite a few bits being factual, most of it is utter crap. It's a collection of urban myths, rumours, pure bunkum, and the fertile imagination of the writer.


I envisage the writer being some narcissistic half-wit who gets a thrill from people reading their garbage.


 


Sadly, about half the group have liked it 


No wonder this country voted Brexit.


Originally Posted by: Saint Snow 


Someone 'helpfully' forwarded to me something very similar a couple of weeks ago and copied around 20-30 others. He wasn't best pleased when I pointed out that it was full of inaccuracies and nonsense. Fortunately a retired doctor on the distribution list confirmed it was misleading.


As you say, why on earth do people think it's clever to write this stuff?


Location: South Cambridgeshire
130 metres ASL
52.0N 0.1E


Gavin D
27 March 2020 23:01:59
Spain have reported 7,933 new cases and 773 new deaths

____________________________

New cases are down by 338

New deaths have increased by 55

Changes with yesterday
Bugglesgate
27 March 2020 23:04:48

Just watching "lessons learned" on Newsnight, but no mention of the true lessons to be learned. Here is my list:

1. When a novel virus breaks out in January, take note immediately and take action. Start ordering PPE for health staff and carers. Start ordering whatever looks like it will be required - in this case, ventilators and compressed oxygen.
2. As other places start to show signs of infection, enforce mandatory and monitored quarantine for everyone coming from such regions, whether citizen or foreigner.
3. Tell your own citizens to cancel their foreign holidays and assure them that if they still travel,it is entirely at their own risk.

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum 


I think China needs to come down like a ton of bricks on the ridiculous  "wildlife dinners" and the markets that facilitate them.  God alone knows what other horrors are lurking  in pangolins and other wild creatures,  We may actually have got off lightly with this one !


The other lesson we've learned is,  given  the way the modern world is configured, it's impossible to stop this stuff spreading globally once  it's   seriously got going.   Even China couldn't halt  it completely let alone Western countries with planes  criss crossing  in and out of infected areas.


 


 


 


Chris (It,its)
Between Newbury and Basingstoke
"When they are giving you their all, some stagger and fall, after all it's not easy banging your heart against some mad buggers wall"
Gandalf The White
27 March 2020 23:05:02

Just watching "lessons learned" on Newsnight, but no mention of the true lessons to be learned. Here is my list:

1. When a novel virus breaks out in January, take note immediately and take action. Start ordering PPE for health staff and carers. Start ordering whatever looks like it will be required - in this case, ventilators and compressed oxygen.
2. As other places start to show signs of infection, enforce mandatory and monitored quarantine for everyone coming from such regions, whether citizen or foreigner.
3. Tell your own citizens to cancel their foreign holidays and assure them that if they still travel,it is entirely at their own risk.

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum 


 


Does that still apply when it breaks out in November, which it did?


😉


 


That aside, you still seem intent on overlooking the fact that by the time you have 'signs of infection' in 'other places' it's already too late.  In the case of SARS-Cov2 at least a couple of weeks to late.


Plus, how exactly you do you force people to cancel trips?  


Location: South Cambridgeshire
130 metres ASL
52.0N 0.1E


Gandalf The White
27 March 2020 23:20:11


 


I think China needs to come down like a ton of bricks on the ridiculous  "wildlife dinners" and the markets that facilitate them.  God alone knows what other horrors are lurking  in pangolins and other wild creatures,  We may actually have got off lightly with this one !


The other lesson we've learned is,  given  the way the modern world is configured, it's impossible to stop this stuff spreading globally once  it's   seriously got going.   Even China couldn't halt  it completely let alone Western countries with planes  criss crossing  in and out of infected areas.


 


Originally Posted by: Bugglesgate 


China is responsible for a range of dubious practices which include being largely responsible for the slaughter of rhinos and elephants as well as, for some, their, shall we say, idisosyncratic eating habits.  I'm not sure how the authorities can eradicate the problem; do you aim at the illegal supply or the illegal demand?


 


On your second point, that's absolutely the problem - but with another ingredient: a growing population is putting humans into more frequent contact with wild areas. That has caused outbreaks of Ebola, SARS 1 and 2 and MERS - not to mention HIV/AIDS.  The scary part is that the reservoir of viruses sitting in wild animals cannot be eradicated and all we can do is monitor assiduously to detect these outbreaks as early as possible.  China trying to cover up this one shouldn't be part of the script.


 


Location: South Cambridgeshire
130 metres ASL
52.0N 0.1E


Phil G
27 March 2020 23:21:07


 


I think China needs to come down like a ton of bricks on the ridiculous  "wildlife dinners" and the markets that facilitate them.  God alone knows what other horrors are lurking  in pangolins and other wild creatures,  We may actually have got off lightly with this one !


The other lesson we've learned is,  given  the way the modern world is configured, it's impossible to stop this stuff spreading globally once  it's   seriously got going.   Even China couldn't halt  it completely let alone Western countries with planes  criss crossing  in and out of infected areas.


 


 


 


Originally Posted by: Bugglesgate 


Just hope hantavirus does not become the next global killer from China. 38% death rate!


https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11247616/what-hantavirus-symptoms-how-spread/


 

Gandalf The White
27 March 2020 23:33:03


 


Just hope hantavirus does not become the next global killer from China. 38% death rate!


https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11247616/what-hantavirus-symptoms-how-spread/


 


Originally Posted by: Phil G 


There isn't any person to person transmission of the hantavirus. Unless it undergoes a significant mutation, of which there's been no evidence so far, then it cannot cause a pandemic.


 https://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=229363


 


Location: South Cambridgeshire
130 metres ASL
52.0N 0.1E


Gavin D
27 March 2020 23:45:28
New York City have reported 1,124 new cases and 84 new deaths.

State total - 45,934 cases and 603 deaths
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