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Northern Sky
05 May 2020 14:26:27


 


How can you take seriously someone who insists that the mortality rate (infected people / deaths) is 0.1%, when 0.22% of the total NYC population has died so far? This is not being open minded.


 


Originally Posted by: xioni2 


I don't have the stats (or more importantly an understanding of the stats) to know one way or another but I'm not sure why I wouldn't take the views of a Professor of virology seriously? I'm certain he has a degree of expertise that is greater than either yours or mine. So as I say, I'll keep an open mind.

pfw
  • pfw
  • Advanced Member
05 May 2020 14:28:22

UK "slow response" makes top item on CBC this morning https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/uk-coronavirus-1.5554837


Some possible signs of good news in Ontario and a small amount of re-opening https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/covid-19-coronavirus-ontario-may-4-update-1.5554273 . A huge proportion of cases have been in care homes.


The weather was good this weekend (22c), traffic levels getting closer to normal IMO. It's a like an unofficial gradual lockdown release - almost as if there is a tacit acceptance of travel as long as people keep to social distancing and avoid gatherings. Might be short lived though - In standard  Canadian spring tradition we have snow forecast for Friday which is going to look odd falling on people's pools that were in use a couple of days ago!


 


--
Paul.
Retron
05 May 2020 14:28:37

I've ordered a private antibody (ELISA-based IgG) test. It'll be coming tomorrow or Thursday, but because of the need to return the blood sample quickly, I probabbly won't be taking the test until Monday.


I'll be interested, then, to see if the headteacher at work's thoughts are correct (she remains utterly convinced I had covid-19 in late March).


Leysdown, north Kent
xioni2
05 May 2020 14:34:23


I don't have the stats (or more importantly an understanding of the stats) to know one way or another but I'm not sure why I wouldn't take the views of a Professor of virology seriously? I'm certain he has a degree of expertise that is greater than either yours or mine. So as I say, I'll keep an open mind.


Originally Posted by: Northern Sky 


No, you shouldn't take his opinion seriously when the facts prove him wrong. The fact that his opinion is also an outlier compared to other virologists is another red flag. This is not being open minded. 

Gavin D
05 May 2020 14:56:02

Deaths by region to 5pm yesterday in England



  • East Of England - 2,504

  • London - 5,231

  • Midlands - 4,266

  • North East And Yorkshire - 3,018

  • North West - 3,230

  • South East - 2,513

  • South West - 988

Northern Sky
05 May 2020 15:05:01


 


No, you shouldn't take his opinion seriously when the facts prove him wrong. The fact that his opinion is also an outlier compared to other virologists is another red flag. This is not being open minded. 


Originally Posted by: xioni2 


Nonsense. The facts vary massively from place to place and could be dependent on a whole host of factors. Professor Streek has the IFR at 0.36 although he thinks it may be closer to 0.24 - 0.26%. 


He's not alone with that assessment and as he is a professor of virology at the university of Bonn I think it's absurd to blithely dismiss his opinions.

four
  • four
  • Advanced Member
05 May 2020 15:12:01

Worth a read:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/health-fitness/body/covid-19-just-really-bad-cold-happened-had-antibody-test-find/

Her boyfriend tested positive for corona earlier in the year. She had the symptoms of corona / flu / bad cold and was convinced it was it. However, one of the new antibody tests returns negative.

Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 



Odds on that confirms the test isn't 100% reliable (as article states).


If boyfriend had it and she had classic symptoms too from a couple of days later it's hard to believe otherwise unless his positive test was wrong instead - equally likely 


Brian Gaze
05 May 2020 15:22:34

Virgin Atlantic cutting 3,000 jobs and suspending ops from Gatwick, same route as BA.
Makes you wonder if, as and when there is a return to holidays outside the UK, what types will be possible.
With many restrictions on ships, I could see cruising being popular but only for departures from the UK.
Once airlines have got to grips with 'how they handle passengers', villas may be popular where people there can more or less self isolate.
I do wonder about package holidays though where there is a certain amount of mixing just about everywhere.

Originally Posted by: Phil G 


At this rate property developers will soon be offering to buy Gatwick for a fiver.


Brian Gaze
Berkhamsted
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"I'm not socialist, I know that. I don't believe in sharing my money." - Gary Numan
Brian Gaze
05 May 2020 15:24:23


I've ordered a private antibody (ELISA-based IgG) test. It'll be coming tomorrow or Thursday, but because of the need to return the blood sample quickly, I probabbly won't be taking the test until Monday.


I'll be interested, then, to see if the headteacher at work's thoughts are correct (she remains utterly convinced I had covid-19 in late March).


Originally Posted by: Retron 


Where are you buying from?I 've got nothing better to spend my money on the moment and the Mrs still thinks we may have had it.


Brian Gaze
Berkhamsted
TWO Buzz - get the latest news and views 
"I'm not socialist, I know that. I don't believe in sharing my money." - Gary Numan
Phil G
05 May 2020 15:32:15


 


At this rate property developers will soon be offering to buy Gatwick for a fiver.


Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 


With the north terminal there being closed, makes you wonder if and when that would reopen with other airlines reducing their flights as well.


Just thinking about a guy I know we contact to minibus us to airports and functions such as weddings. No business for them at the moment and god knows how many taxi drivers there are round the country with no business.

Retron
05 May 2020 15:43:24


Where are you buying from?I 've got nothing better to spend my money on the moment and the Mrs still thinks we may have had it.


Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 


I ordered it from here:


https://bluehorizonbloodtests.co.uk/


They don't specify exactly which test it is, other than it's one of the CE-marked ones (which means it's one of Abbott or Roche, last time I checked).


It's expensive, but on the other hand I've missed four trips to the wolf centre... which together would cost a lot more than that test!


Leysdown, north Kent
David M Porter
05 May 2020 15:45:52


 


It’s absolutely heart breaking. 


I saw a piece on the news yesterday from New Zealand, how they are dealing with the crisis under the leadership of Jacinda Ardern. 


I know there are various factors why NZ was less vulnerable than the UK to this disease - physical geography & population density being a couple of them.


That said, I can’t help but feel the effects of COVID-19 on this country, most specifically our horrendous death toll, are symptomatic of bigger issues in our politics and in our society. 


This specific outcome for the UK almost felt inevitable. This is subjective but I feel like we’ve been losing our way for a long while. 


Originally Posted by: Joe Bloggs 


I agree completely with everything you say Joe. The death toll in this country is truly dreadful.


Back I early-mid March around the time the crisis began to develop in this country, I can clearly recall at least one member here in one of the early coronavirus threads predicting that the UK would end up with a similar number of deaths from Covid-19 as Italy by the time the outbreak reached its peak here. Sadly, it seems that their words have been borne out.


As well as NZ, it seems that Germany has generally done a better job of controlling the spread of the disease and keeping the number of deaths to a rather lower level than the UK has seen and they have at least as big a population as the UK does. For me, the fact that both Germany and NZ acted much quicker in terms of taking the necessary steps to protect their people from the worst of the virus as much as they could is likely a major factor in why their respective fatality tolls have been so much lower than that of the UK.


Lenzie, Glasgow

"Let us not take ourselves too seriously. None of us has a monopoly on wisdom, and we must always be ready to listen and respect other points of view."- Queen Elizabeth II 1926-2022
Brian Gaze
05 May 2020 15:51:32


 


I ordered it from here:


https://bluehorizonbloodtests.co.uk/


They don't specify exactly which test it is, other than it's one of the CE-marked ones (which means it's one of Abbott or Roche, last time I checked).


It's expensive, but on the other hand I've missed four trips to the wolf centre... which together would cost a lot more than that test!


Originally Posted by: Retron 


 The price of £99 seems reasonable for a reputable antibody test. I suspect the only problem they will have is keeping up with demand.


Brian Gaze
Berkhamsted
TWO Buzz - get the latest news and views 
"I'm not socialist, I know that. I don't believe in sharing my money." - Gary Numan
four
  • four
  • Advanced Member
05 May 2020 15:54:53
They are a bit cagey about accuracy though, it says should be done within 21 days of suspected infection which might tie in with that woman being negative despite being ill in January
Retron
05 May 2020 16:03:01

They are a bit cagey about accuracy though, it says should be done within 21 days of suspected infection which might tie in with that woman being negative despite being ill in January

Originally Posted by: four 


"Test at least 21 days post exposure to COVID-19/onset of symptoms."


It's actually the opposite - a minimum of three weeks.


As antibodies peak after 2 weeks, it makes sense - the more antibodies, the better the accuracy will be.


 


Leysdown, north Kent
Gavin D
05 May 2020 16:04:13
84,806 tests yesterday

4,406 new cases
Roger Parsons
05 May 2020 16:07:34


An interesting article. His conclusion, of course, was that it isn’t doing more harm than good.


This part made me roll my eyes: “More than that, a growing economy seems to keep people alive. The correlation between GDP per capita and life expectancy isn’t exactly 1:1, but it’s pretty strong, by the standards of most social-science findings. “


Either poorly expressed or just wrong. It is not growth that is the basis of the correlation but wealth, and wealth measured over a sustained period to boot.


Originally Posted by: Gandalf The White 


I suspect this is an example of a correlation being viewed as a cause, Gandalf, when it is more complex than that.


On a happier note - 3 swifts overhead here today!


Roger


RogerP
West Lindsey district of Lincolnshire
Everything taken together, here in Lincolnshire are more good things than man could have had the conscience to ask.
William Cobbett, in his Rural Rides - c.1830
Gavin D
05 May 2020 16:09:41
 693 all settings deaths in the UK
Gavin D
05 May 2020 16:16:55

Daily slides


Transport



Daily tests



New cases



Estimated hospital admissions in England



People in hospital



Critical care beds



Deaths with rolling 7-day average


xioni2
05 May 2020 16:19:03


Nonsense. The facts vary massively from place to place and could be dependent on a whole host of factors. Professor Streek has the IFR at 0.36 although he thinks it may be closer to 0.24 - 0.26%. 


He's not alone with that assessment and as he is a professor of virology at the university of Bonn I think it's absurd to blithely dismiss his opinions.


Originally Posted by: Northern Sky 


I don't think you even read what I wrote. I am not talking about the CFR, I am saying it's a fact that 0.22% of the total NYC population has died so far. Even if 100% of New Yorkers had been infected, that would give a CFR of 0.22% so far. 


The Swedish professor might have meant a CFR of 0.1% in Sweden (still unknown and unproven), but what I am saying is that the facts are showing that other countries and health care systems will have much higher mortality rates, so he should make that distinction when he makes those wild claims.


Is this so difficult to understand? Can't you see that 1 in 440 New York residents have died so far? 

Gavin D
05 May 2020 16:21:25
13,208 in hospital down from 13,258 yesterday
Gavin D
05 May 2020 16:25:32

Italy



  • 1,075 new cases 

  • 236 deaths 

Darren S
05 May 2020 16:37:22

13,208 in hospital down from 13,258 yesterday

Originally Posted by: Gavin D 


Excluding Northern Ireland AGAIN


Darren
Crowthorne, Berks (87m asl)
South Berks Winter Snow Depth Totals:
2023/24 0 cm; 2022/23 7 cm; 2021/22 1 cm; 2020/21 13 cm; 2019/20 0 cm; 2018/19 14 cm; 2017/18 23 cm; 2016/17 0 cm; 2015/16 0.5 cm; 2014/15 3.5 cm; 2013/14 0 cm; 2012/13 22 cm; 2011/12 7 cm; 2010/11 6 cm; 2009/10 51 cm
Gavin D
05 May 2020 16:38:00

Regional data for new cases today in England


The 7 English regions 



  • London +252 (1.0%) 25,240

  • Midlands +295 (1.4%) 21,226

  • North West +340 (1.6%) 20,768

  • North East and Yorkshire +396 (2.0%) 19,629

  • South East +243 (1.4%) 17,999

  • East of England +162 (1.4%) 11,239

  • South West +86 (1.3%) 6,657


The 10 local areas with the highest cases



  1. Kent +63 (1.8%) 3,544

  2. Lancashire +42 (1.4%) 2,962

  3. Birmingham +26 (0.9%) 2,954

  4. Hampshire +28 (1.0%) 2,915

  5. Essex +35 (1.3%) 2,699

  6. Surrey +21 (0.8%) 2,647

  7. Hertfordshire +32 (1.3%) 2,411

  8. Sheffield +28 (1.2%) 2,248

  9. Cumbria +19 (0.9%) 2,007

  10. Staffordshire +21 (1.1%) 1,843


The 10 local areas with the lowest cases



  1. Rutland +1 (4.5%) 22

  2. North East Lincolnshire +1 (0.7%) 137

  3. Isle of Wight +2 (1.4%) 145

  4. Torbay +1 (0.5%) 209

  5. Hartlepool +9 (4.3%) 210

  6. Bath and North East Somerset +2 (0.9%) 217

  7. Bracknell Forest +4 (1.8%) 222

  8. North Somerset +1 (0.4%) 257

  9. Calderdale +4 (1.5%) 259

  10. Windsor and Maidenhead +2 (0.8%) 261

xioni2
05 May 2020 16:45:55

Regarding the effectiveness of the lockdown, a new study claims to show that the lockdown in Italy has worked well with the R values below 1 everywhere now. They estimate the percentage of the population in Lombardy that got infected at 10-17% and their modelling shows that without a test-trace-isolate strategy, a release of the lockdown will result in a second surge of infections and deaths.


Their estimated mortality rates are 1-1.4%.


 

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