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Sevendust
25 December 2013 20:32:24



gets there at second attempt. Perhaps we may not need to wait until mid month


Originally Posted by: Gandalf The White 




Indeed a stunning day 10 chart from the ECM best for ages. Snow for many if it comes off!


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Recm2401.html

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Recm2402.html

Originally Posted by: Ally Pally Snowman 


 


Certainly cold enough on that chart - 850hPa temperatures across the south -5 to -6C, 500-1,000hPa thickness values around low to mid 520s.  My reservation would be the weak ridge and westerly flow shown on that chart.  Cold but most likely clear and dry for many away from western coastal areas.


If that LP just SE of Iceland moves east - or better still south-east - then the potential increases a little.  Otherwise we're looking for disturbances and small scale features in the flow, which don't get modelled until very near the time (inside T+24).



 

Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


Well put


Btw I'm also stuffed and can't move(apart from typing)

Quantum
25 December 2013 20:42:19


quantum, you spent weeks touting the height rises the other side of the pole and now we have winter on our 'doorstep' you dont want to believe it !


Originally Posted by: nickl 


Give me some credit, we did at least get a cold snap out of it. And a quiter atlantic did help promote at least some cold towards the british isles. But no, I do not think a cold snap is anywhere near our doorstep; even taken at face value we are still looking into the low res part of the GFS. The blocking indicated by the ECM is weak, and has very little chance of becoming prominent while we still have that cyclone factory over canada. Perhaps things may change by the 2nd week of january, but I would be amazed if we get cold before then. 


Twitter: @QuantumOverlord (general), @MedicaneWatch (medicane/TC stuff)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
Maunder Minimum
25 December 2013 20:44:42


Looks really bad in Northern Italy too.

New world order coming.
Gandalf The White
25 December 2013 21:26:34



gets there at second attempt. Perhaps we may not need to wait until mid month


Originally Posted by: Sevendust 




Indeed a stunning day 10 chart from the ECM best for ages. Snow for many if it comes off!


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Recm2401.html

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Recm2402.html

Originally Posted by: Gandalf The White 


 


Certainly cold enough on that chart - 850hPa temperatures across the south -5 to -6C, 500-1,000hPa thickness values around low to mid 520s.  My reservation would be the weak ridge and westerly flow shown on that chart.  Cold but most likely clear and dry for many away from western coastal areas.


If that LP just SE of Iceland moves east - or better still south-east - then the potential increases a little.  Otherwise we're looking for disturbances and small scale features in the flow, which don't get modelled until very near the time (inside T+24).



 

Originally Posted by: Ally Pally Snowman 


Well put


Btw I'm also stuffed and can't move(apart from typing)

Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 



LOL Dave, I can empathise - usual Xmas afternoon/evening feeling... :-)

At least model watching isn't absorbing too much time for a day or two - but half an eye on the next storm arriving on Friday. Then more next week. Wouldn't a nice friendly a anticyclone be nice....
Location: South Cambridgeshire
130 metres ASL
52.0N 0.1E


David M Porter
25 December 2013 21:37:55




gets there at second attempt. Perhaps we may not need to wait until mid month


Originally Posted by: Gandalf The White 




Indeed a stunning day 10 chart from the ECM best for ages. Snow for many if it comes off!


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Recm2401.html

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Recm2402.html

Originally Posted by: Sevendust 


 


Certainly cold enough on that chart - 850hPa temperatures across the south -5 to -6C, 500-1,000hPa thickness values around low to mid 520s.  My reservation would be the weak ridge and westerly flow shown on that chart.  Cold but most likely clear and dry for many away from western coastal areas.


If that LP just SE of Iceland moves east - or better still south-east - then the potential increases a little.  Otherwise we're looking for disturbances and small scale features in the flow, which don't get modelled until very near the time (inside T+24).



 

Originally Posted by: Gandalf The White 


Well put


Btw I'm also stuffed and can't move(apart from typing)


Originally Posted by: Ally Pally Snowman 



LOL Dave, I can empathise - usual Xmas afternoon/evening feeling... :-)

At least model watching isn't absorbing too much time for a day or two - but half an eye on the next storm arriving on Friday. Then more next week. Wouldn't a nice friendly a anticyclone be nice....

Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


This reminds me in some ways of Xmas week last year when many people were getting increasingly desperate for some dry weather in view of the seemingly endless rain we were getting at that time, which all came at the end of an exceptionally wet year. Having said all that I can't recall any instances of high winds with any of the LP systems that crossed over the British Isles this time last year.


I also recall that last Christmas, there were some subtle hints appearing in the FI range of the model runs of a change occuring in the weather once we had reached the end of the last festive season. It was difficult to know at the time what kind of a change it would be, but by early January this year it was fairly clear IIRC that the zonal weather that dominated the end of last year was about to come to an end. Let's hope that we soon see an end to this current wild spell.


Lenzie, Glasgow

"Let us not take ourselves too seriously. None of us has a monopoly on wisdom, and we must always be ready to listen and respect other points of view."- Queen Elizabeth II 1926-2022
Gandalf The White
25 December 2013 21:39:30



Am I correct in remembering a few dream charts from Xmas past, that soon disappeared once the festive season was over? Aeroplane data or some such.

Originally Posted by: Quantum 



But they're not! These kinds of Synoptics for after the new year have been showing up on gfs for over week, it's just they keep looking better the closer we get... also most on here where either blinded by the constant bombardment of storms or simply refused to take note of the bigger picture that was and has continued to be modelled by the gfs.

I said on here a few days ago I think we would be looking at a significant cold blast into the second week of January. (Who knows maybe a little early) :)

Maybe my memory is hazy here but I'm sure it was the gfs that first picked up on the block of 09/10 and again 2010.., ECM played catch up both times.

Originally Posted by: picturesareme 




If i'm honest, my intuition says until that cold air clears from canada; I really think we will struggle to setup any kind of block. 


Originally Posted by: Quantum 



What has been showing though originates towards the north/ northeast with the block transitioning towards Greenland. Though other variants have had it descending over Greenland from the pole.

Originally Posted by: picturesareme 


Yeh but conditions have been favourible over the arctic for a while, the falling AO now is no different. Personally I think that a block may start to setup, but will topple very easily to the storms coming in from canada. That seems more of a natural solution at the moment, then the storms being deflected to the north or the south. Having said that, if we can get a big LP delayed by a greenland high, then that may start to introduce some much needed WAA, and may in the long run cause a transition to colder weather after another attempt or so. My guess is we will have to wait until mid january, or at least the 2nd week. 


Originally Posted by: Quantum 



I'm stilling sticking to what I said a few days ago, we will be staring down the barrels of a significant cold spell by the 9th January. 🙂

Originally Posted by: picturesareme 


To be fair 9th of january is the 2nd week 


But I don't share your confidence, we have such an unusually cold pool over canada; wanting to keep the natural order of things going verses tenous attempts at northern blocking. Actually the GFS and ECM cool things down, rather than the converse. Also while Canada has a cold pool, Europe and scandanavia don't so even if a block does setup; it will not instantly produce cold weather, and a transition period of days may be expected. 


If I had to be specific (which is probably a bad idea)


I would say that there will be a notherly toppler sometime around the 9th of january mark, proceeded by a mild spell and then perhaps a more sustained cold spell provided things continue to look favourible which may not be the case. It might just be a mild snowless winter this year. 

Originally Posted by: Edicius81 



Quantum, whilst there is a lot of cold air over eastern Canada it doesn't follow inevitably either that there will be endless cyclogenesis or that the LP systems must come eastwards - it's more complex than that, as I'm sure you know.

It's quite possible for the jet to realign onto a more northerly track and take a low pressure towards the west of Greenland. We've seen this happen before.

Location: South Cambridgeshire
130 metres ASL
52.0N 0.1E


Gooner
25 December 2013 21:42:20

Of course it depends what people call a cold snap in terms of temps and longevity?


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Quantum
25 December 2013 21:43:25




Am I correct in remembering a few dream charts from Xmas past, that soon disappeared once the festive season was over? Aeroplane data or some such.

Originally Posted by: Gandalf The White 



But they're not! These kinds of Synoptics for after the new year have been showing up on gfs for over week, it's just they keep looking better the closer we get... also most on here where either blinded by the constant bombardment of storms or simply refused to take note of the bigger picture that was and has continued to be modelled by the gfs.

I said on here a few days ago I think we would be looking at a significant cold blast into the second week of January. (Who knows maybe a little early) :)

Maybe my memory is hazy here but I'm sure it was the gfs that first picked up on the block of 09/10 and again 2010.., ECM played catch up both times.

Originally Posted by: Quantum 




If i'm honest, my intuition says until that cold air clears from canada; I really think we will struggle to setup any kind of block. 


Originally Posted by: picturesareme 



What has been showing though originates towards the north/ northeast with the block transitioning towards Greenland. Though other variants have had it descending over Greenland from the pole.

Originally Posted by: Quantum 


Yeh but conditions have been favourible over the arctic for a while, the falling AO now is no different. Personally I think that a block may start to setup, but will topple very easily to the storms coming in from canada. That seems more of a natural solution at the moment, then the storms being deflected to the north or the south. Having said that, if we can get a big LP delayed by a greenland high, then that may start to introduce some much needed WAA, and may in the long run cause a transition to colder weather after another attempt or so. My guess is we will have to wait until mid january, or at least the 2nd week. 


Originally Posted by: picturesareme 



I'm stilling sticking to what I said a few days ago, we will be staring down the barrels of a significant cold spell by the 9th January. 🙂

Originally Posted by: Quantum 


To be fair 9th of january is the 2nd week 


But I don't share your confidence, we have such an unusually cold pool over canada; wanting to keep the natural order of things going verses tenous attempts at northern blocking. Actually the GFS and ECM cool things down, rather than the converse. Also while Canada has a cold pool, Europe and scandanavia don't so even if a block does setup; it will not instantly produce cold weather, and a transition period of days may be expected. 


If I had to be specific (which is probably a bad idea)


I would say that there will be a notherly toppler sometime around the 9th of january mark, proceeded by a mild spell and then perhaps a more sustained cold spell provided things continue to look favourible which may not be the case. It might just be a mild snowless winter this year. 


Originally Posted by: picturesareme 



Quantum, whilst there is a lot of cold air over eastern Canada it doesn't follow inevitably either that there will be endless cyclogenesis or that the LP systems must come eastwards - it's more complex than that, as I'm sure you know.

It's quite possible for the jet to realign onto a more northerly track and take a low pressure towards the west of Greenland. We've seen this happen before.

Originally Posted by: Edicius81 


Yes, but I don't think thats the sort of detail thats resolvable at 240h, and the most natural course would be directly eastward imo atm. 


Twitter: @QuantumOverlord (general), @MedicaneWatch (medicane/TC stuff)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
Gooner
25 December 2013 21:44:03

http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2013122518/gfsnh-0-42.png?18


Rough again for the North


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Gooner
25 December 2013 22:49:49

http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2013122518/gfsnh-0-300.png?18


GFS again heading in the right direction ...........................for cold fans


http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2013122518/gfsnh-0-384.png?18


http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2013122518/gfsnh-1-384.png?18


 


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Rob K
25 December 2013 22:51:07
http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn36015.png 

W is for Winter!

I see a trend... 🙂
Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl
"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome
Chiltern Blizzard
25 December 2013 23:48:16
Happy Christmas Everyone.

Two thoughts:

Firstly,GFS ops are showing notable consistency at 2 weeks in generating both altantic and high-level blocking and low pressure to our SE... Echos of consistency before 2010 spell but need a couple more days of this before we can have any level of confidence.

Secondly, low temps over arctic canada simply don't inevitably lead to a raging zonal atlantic jet. Late Dec 62 saw low temps and heights over eastern arctic canada, and yet that didn't stop the coldest winter for 200 years developing!

Andrew
Rendlesham, Suffolk 20m asl
Gandalf The White
26 December 2013 01:06:16

Happy Christmas Everyone.

Two thoughts:

Firstly,GFS ops are showing notable consistency at 2 weeks in generating both altantic and high-level blocking and low pressure to our SE... Echos of consistency before 2010 spell but need a couple more days of this before we can have any level of confidence.

Secondly, low temps over arctic canada simply don't inevitably lead to a raging zonal atlantic jet. Late Dec 62 saw low temps and heights over eastern arctic canada, and yet that didn't stop the coldest winter for 200 years developing!

Andrew

Originally Posted by: Chiltern Blizzard 



I agree with your point about the implications of a cold airmass over eastern Canada, as I suggested to Quantum earlier. Given that eastern Canada is routinely very cold in winter it simply cannot be the case that it always leads to raging zonality.

The ECM 12z ensemble run continues to trend colder. There are even a few ice days in there...

http://www.weathercast.co.uk/services/ensemble-forecast.html 



Location: South Cambridgeshire
130 metres ASL
52.0N 0.1E


haghir22
26 December 2013 01:09:11

Happy Christmas Everyone.

Two thoughts:

Firstly,GFS ops are showing notable consistency at 2 weeks in generating both altantic and high-level blocking and low pressure to our SE... Echos of consistency before 2010 spell but need a couple more days of this before we can have any level of confidence.

Secondly, low temps over arctic canada simply don't inevitably lead to a raging zonal atlantic jet. Late Dec 62 saw low temps and heights over eastern arctic canada, and yet that didn't stop the coldest winter for 200 years developing!

Andrew

Originally Posted by: Gandalf The White 



I agree with your point about the implications of a cold airmass over eastern Canada, as I suggested to Quantum earlier. Given that eastern Canada is routinely very cold in winter it simply cannot be the case that it always leads to raging zonality.

The ECM 12z ensemble run continues to trend colder. There are even a few ice days in there...

http://www.weathercast.co.uk/services/ensemble-forecast.html 


Originally Posted by: Chiltern Blizzard 


Just starting to look like a bit of consistency for early Jan.


YNWA
Quantum
26 December 2013 01:15:09

Happy Christmas Everyone.

Two thoughts:

Firstly,GFS ops are showing notable consistency at 2 weeks in generating both altantic and high-level blocking and low pressure to our SE... Echos of consistency before 2010 spell but need a couple more days of this before we can have any level of confidence.

Secondly, low temps over arctic canada simply don't inevitably lead to a raging zonal atlantic jet. Late Dec 62 saw low temps and heights over eastern arctic canada, and yet that didn't stop the coldest winter for 200 years developing!

Andrew

Originally Posted by: Gandalf The White 



I agree with your point about the implications of a cold airmass over eastern Canada, as I suggested to Quantum earlier. Given that eastern Canada is routinely very cold in winter it simply cannot be the case that it always leads to raging zonality.

The ECM 12z ensemble run continues to trend colder. There are even a few ice days in there...

http://www.weathercast.co.uk/services/ensemble-forecast.html


Originally Posted by: Chiltern Blizzard 


I'm not saying it always does, but cold uppers over E canada certainly doesn't help. And they are unusually cold for the time of year aswell, and right in the vincinity of the atlantic. In '63 in January the 850hpa temps NW of newfoundland were hovering at or just below -5C, at the end of the GFS high res we have uppers in the same place a good 30C lower. Its a chicken and egg situation yes, when blocking starts to happen uppers in that part of the world might lift up. But none of the models are showing any sign of that. The atlantic still looks pretty active. 


Twitter: @QuantumOverlord (general), @MedicaneWatch (medicane/TC stuff)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
nsrobins
26 December 2013 08:28:04

Still only very sketchy signs of anything that will break us out of the westerly train.
ENS as suspecting trending cooler with time but still 'zonal'.


Neil
Fareham, Hampshire 28m ASL (near estuary)
Stormchaser, Member TORRO
Rob K
26 December 2013 08:50:48
ECM and GFS this morning seem to have a Xmas hangover and removed any signs of festive cheer. High pressure to the south and more dross all round! 😞
Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl
"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome
JACKO4EVER
26 December 2013 08:50:49
Morning all. A quick flick through this mornings offerings paints a cool zonal theme with some rain and less bouts of strong winds. I can't see much in the way of winter proper if it's cold your looking for, though the odd frost may be on offer if skies clear and winds drop out at night.
GIBBY
26 December 2013 09:00:34

Good morning everyone. Here is the Boxing Day morning report on what to expect as predicted by the midnight outputs of NWP for today Thursday December 26th 2013.


All models show a weak ridge crossing East today with a new deepening depression crossing the Atlantic towards NW Britain tonight and tomorrow carrying thick cloud, rain and severe gales across the UK. The winds look likely to be less severe across Southern Britain though this time round. By tomorrow morning a cold front crosses quickly East bringing all of the UK under a strong and showery Westerly flow with this weather lasting well into the weekend. On Sunday a weak ridge crosses East damping down the showers ahead of the next series of troughs with rain and strong winds returning later on Sunday and into Monday. Temperatures will range from average levels in the South and a little below in the North where snow may fall from the showers on the hills at times.


GFS then shows the last few days of 2013 with Low pressure out to the NW with rain at times, especially towards the North and West before clearer showery weather turns up for New Years Day itself with more of a Westerly breeze. Into the first week of 2014 and the weather remains very unsettled and rather colder as depressions take on a more SE track across the UK enhancing the colder element on the rear of each depression and allowing snowfall to reach lower levels at times in among the continuing large amounts of rainfall.


UKMO closes it's Boxing Day morning run with Low pressure well established South of Iceland on New Years Day with a broad SW flow with rain at times carried on troughs moving NE on a strong SW wind. It would feel relatively mild, especially in the South.


GEM also continues very unsettled weather into the first week of 2014 though the influence of High pressure to the South and SE is drawing nearer with the emphasis of the very heaviest of the rain shifting more towards NW Britain later with all areas feeling rather milder temperatures at times.


NAVGEM enters 2014 showing a depression crossing East over Southern Britain with chilly and showery conditions with a longer spell of rain crossing East on New Years Day.


ECM today shows an unsettled start to 2014 with rain at times followed by chilly and showery conditions for a day or two in the first week. At the end of the run High pressure from the SW reaches Southern Britain for a time with frost and fog possibilities in a quiet and dry spell here with an attached ridge drying things up in the North too.


The GFS Ensembles show a very flat pattern over the next two weeks showing changes in the pattern over the next few weeks will be slow and not very noticeable to the majority of folk on the ground. The Atlantic bandwagon remains well in control carrying depressions across the Atlantic to the North throughout with just the hint of a temporary more SE track to the Jet flow deeper into Europe for a time with the risk of colder injections at times before the pattern resets late in the run.


The Jet Stream shows no change in the orientation of the flow for the foreseeable future carrying it West to East across the Atlantic and close to or over the UK. The flow does dig South across Europe later in the outputs but remains high across the Atlantic maintaining the milder feed across the UK.


In Summary the weather remains Atlantic driven with a continuing changeable pattern alternating between rain bands crossing East and a sunshine and shower mix in between. With winds generally from a Westerly point the weather looks never overly cold with just polar maritime air delivering some wintry showers to Northern hills at times. There is some suggestion that High pressure could edge up closer to Southern Britain later removing the deeply unsettled weather of late to something drier and much less windy and still not cold though this theory is balanced with the chance of Low pressure slipping SE over Europe and bringing the UK into more cold northerly components and attendant wintry weather for a time.


Martin G
Kilmersdon Radstock Bath Somerset



Look up my New Facebook Weather Page  for all the latest up to the minute weather stories as they happen
The Beast from the East
26 December 2013 09:11:51

ECM control run looks very tasty, but an outlier. Getting to this cold spell is like pulling teeth again. We have to go through this every year!


http://www.knmi.nl/exp/pluim/vijftiendaagse/index.php


"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
nouska
26 December 2013 09:58:56


yes, though I don't think we can look at the '62/63 winter as typical - a Canadian warming in the strat during November led to a very cold blocking pattern already in place by late December; by mid January intense cold was being experienced on both sides of the Atlantic.


http://i.imgur.com/oOXQBru.png


It will be harder for the turnaround to take place this year but I see the Met Office contingency forecast mentioning signs in the models* of a late winter SSW so maybe another cold spring for somewhere.


* Possibly 'high top' GloSea


 

Scandy 1050 MB
26 December 2013 10:04:53


ECM control run looks very tasty, but an outlier. Getting to this cold spell is like pulling teeth again. We have to go through this every year!


http://www.knmi.nl/exp/pluim/vijftiendaagse/index.php


Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


Yes very frustrating, looked like it was on a turn yesterday then this morning GFS backs off a bit and ECM resumes zonal business as usual...having said that, GFS has been trying to turn it colder for a while so may be a weak signal it is picking up on. Straw clutching yes but not as bleak as it looked this time last week currently so more runs as ever needed.  I suspect a cold spell will pop up from nowhere quite quickly IF it happens.

Gusty
26 December 2013 10:23:25

There is evidence from the model output that the PV is going to markedly reduce in its intensity as we move into the New Year. 


There is also evidence of resultant height rises in response to the polar vortex weakening over Greenland and more generally at 70-75 N.


Those wishing for some deeper cold in the long term really need to be studying the behaviour of the Arctic high. We really need to see a strong nosing southwards in the Svalbard region and very cold uppers pushing into Scandinavia.


Before then zonality is likely to become diluted with colder air starting to filter into the UK as a result of this PV weakening. The chances of snow over higher ground in the New Year increases.


Longer term trends are semi encouraging and these need watching.


Members are going to be disappointed if they are relying on seeing the trend on every run at this stage however.


Hope you have all had a great christmas.



 


 


Steve - Folkestone, Kent
Current conditions from my Davis Vantage Vue
https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/IFOLKE11 
Join Kent Weather on Facebook.
https://www.facebook.com/stevewall69/ 



Gooner
26 December 2013 10:41:36


There is evidence from the model output that the PV is going to markedly reduce in its intensity as we move into the New Year. 


There is also evidence of resultant height rises in response to the polar vortex weakening over Greenland and more generally at 70-75 N.


Those wishing for some deeper cold in the long term really need to be studying the behaviour of the Arctic high. We really need to see a strong nosing southwards in the Svalbard region and very cold uppers pushing into Scandinavia.


Before then zonality is likely to become diluted with colder air starting to filter into the UK as a result of this PV weakening. The chances of snow over higher ground in the New Year increases.


Longer term trends are semi encouraging and these need watching.


Members are going to be disappointed if they are relying on seeing the trend on every run at this stage however.


Hope you have all had a great christmas.



 


 


Originally Posted by: Gusty 


we also need to remember it wasn't until the last third of January last year we saw decent snow ( IMBY anyway  20/1/13) there wasn't any real cold all winter last year ( hard frosts -5, -6, -7 etc , again IMBY ) yet when the snow fell it sat around for what seemed an age.


 


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


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