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Phil24
11 February 2016 08:56:04

I know its out in F1 but if the PV verifies over Siberia around 23rd Feb, then the effect of the current SSW which by the way has a few more days to reach its peak, will most certainly have an impact on north western Europe.  I think I read somewhere that it is possible for the SSW to change the rotation of the PV from anti to clockwise, now that would be interesting.  


 


roger63
11 February 2016 08:59:10

Looking at the GEFS ENS the op run looks to be one of the  longer colder ones in terms  of the Scandi HP survival.


At 144h 90% of ENS have Scandi HP but  the jet to NW is stopping any ridging towards Greenland which is what we want for a longer cold spell.


By 192h 50:50 split between milder and colder ENS


By 240h 90% mild Atlanti

GIBBY
11 February 2016 09:04:37
HERE IS MY LATEST ANALYSIS USING DATA SUPPLIED BY THE NWP OUTPUT COVERING 5 OF THE WORLDS MOST POWERFUL WEATHER COMPUTERS ISSUED AT 09:00 ON THURSDAY FEB 11TH 2016

 


THE CURRENT GENERAL SITUATION  A Slack West or SW flow lies across the UK with a weakening trough slipping South over Scotland and a Low pressure area slipping SE towards Northern France tonight and tomorrow with a strengthening Easterly flow over the North by then.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn001.gif


 CURRENT SNOW FORECAST AND FREEZING LEVEL OVER THE UK The freezing level across the British Isles remains at or around 1500ft across the North of the UK and nearer to 4000ft across Southern England. Some snow showers may occur over the mountains of Wales North England and Scotland over the next 24-48hrs.


http://www.snow-forecast.com/maps/dynamic/uk 


http://www.natice.noaa.gov/pub/ims/ims_gif/DATA/cursnow.gif 


MODELS-2 WEEK HEADLINE  Mostly unsettled with rain or showers. Fluctuating temperatures with some snow at times over higher ground especially in the South at the weekend.


THE GFS JET STREAM FORECAST  The Jet Stream is blowing due east to the South of the UK today. It maintains this position for several more days before the flow splits next week with one arm under a deep trough to the South and a weaker arm going North of the UK. This pattern then persists for some time before towards the end of the run the flow becomes more defined in a West to East flow across the UK at the term of the run.


http://www.netweather.tv/index.cgi?action=jetstream 


GFS OPERATIONAL The GFS Operational Run today shows benign conditions over the next few days as it stays rather chilly with a few showers. Over the weekend the South sees rain as Low pressure slides ESE across Southern Britain with some of this turning to snow as it engages developing cold East and then North winds across the UK by early next week. Following this a period of cold, clear and frosty weather under a strong ridge of High pressure becomes displaced by further cloudy and rainy weather coming in from the West later next week. This develops a battle with the increasingly high Scandinavian Pressure and disrupts the troughs away SE and again producing the risk of colder weather with some snow for some. It's then not until towards the end of the second week that Westerly winds finally take command in bringing milder winds with rain at times especially across the North and West.


GFS CONTROL RUN The theme of the Control Run again largely follows the theme of the Operational Run with the weather pattern finally changing next week as the South in particular comes under and maintains the influence of High pressure by then to the East with any fronts moving in from the West weakening and disrupting SE as pressure builds back across the UK. On this run too it's not until the end of the second week that wet and windy Atlantic Low pressure moves across all areas from the West. 


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn1441.gif 


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn3841.gif


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/gefs_cartes.php?code=0&ech=144&mode=0&carte=0


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/gefs_cartes.php?code=0&ech=384&mode=0&carte=0 


GFS ENSEMBLE DAY 14 DATA The GFS Clusters today all support High pressure lying just to the South or SW of the UK in 14 days. 15% of these support a cold North or NW flow as a result with cold conditions and showers as a result. Another 15% show High pressure close to the SE with much milder air for many with 70% showing High pressure to the SW with most of the unsettled Westerly winds affecting the North more than down here in the South.


http://www.weatheronline.co.uk/cgi-bin/expertcharts?LANG=en&MENU=0000000000&CONT=euro&MODELL=gefs&MODELLTYP=2&BASE=-&VAR=cpre&HH=372&ZOOM=0&ARCHIV=0&RES=0&WMO=&PERIOD= 


UKMO The UKMO model this morning shows Sunday and Monday being very cold across the UK with wintry showers near windward coasts of the North and East following Saturday's wet and windy conditions with snow on hills. Then as a strong High pressure ridge slips SE to lie across the South by midweek at the same time as milder SW winds re-establish across the North and West with some rain at times. The fine weather does look like it could hang on rather longer across the far South and East into late next week.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rukm1441.gif 


THE FAX CHARTS The Fax Charts today illustrate the difficult task that the models are having in the positioning of the Low pressure area expected to cross SW and South Britain at the weekend. This morning charts have adjusted the centre of Low pressure very close to the South coast before it gently moves away East into Europe early next week. Rain and sleet as a result in the South should slowly clear SE by Monday with a cold North or NE flow bringing wintry showers to the North and East for a time early next week.


http://www.weathercharts.org/ukmomslp.htm#t120 


GEM GEM today offers a much more straightforward evolution of high pressure sliding SE across the UK after this weekends Low complex moves away SE by early next week. The wind, rain, sleet and cold weather will be replaced later next week by milder Westerly winds with some rain at times especially in the North by the second weekend.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rgem2401.gif 


NAVGEM NAVGEM takes a much more complex route as High pressure having moved it's way SE across the UK early next week remains strong and influential to the East of the UK later delaying the progress of milder SW winds and in fact reversing the theme back towards colder and still somewhat unsettled weather across the UK as we lie under shallow Low pressure by the end of next week as a result of disrupting Low pressure around an Atlantic trough soon after midweek.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rnvg1681.gif 


ECM ECM also delays the milder weather reaching the UK next week as like NAVGEM it disrupts the trough that would otherwise bring milder Westerly winds and no doubt giving a day or two of raw, cloudy weather with a little rain instead before the Westerly flow eventually takes hold across the UK proper late next week with wind and rain spreading through all areas at times by the end of the run.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Recm2401.gif 


ECM 10 DAY MEAN The 10 day mean chart today has taken a marked turn to bringing the Jet flow further North than has been shown in recent days with a North/South split in conditions in the weather looking more likely. So in 10 days I would suggest the greatest chance being that ECM thinks we will lie under a milder Westerly flow with rain at times chiefly over the North but to all areas at times.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Reem2401.gif 


NOTABLE TRENDS & CHANGES FROM PREVIOUS RUNS The overall message is a little mixed but with the theme of milder Westerly winds in 10 days following a messy period when milder air may be delayed for a time through midweek next week being the main disagreements behind today's output.


31 DAY HISTORICAL VERIFICATION STATS FOR GFS, UKMO & ECM The verification Statistics of GFS, UKMO and ECM show at 24 hours ECM ahead at 99.6 pts with UKMO at 99.5 pts and GFS at 99.4 pts.  At 3 days ECM is leading with 97.7 pts to UKMO's 97.1 pts while GFS lags behind at 96.6 pts. At 5 days ECM leads with 91.3 pts to UKMO at 89.3 pts and GFS at 88.5 pts. Then at 8 Days ECM has the leading spot from GFS with 67.5 pts to 64.4 pts. Finally at Day 10 GFS leads today at 49.2 pts to ECM's 48.2 pts.


http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS_vsdb/allmodel/daily/cor/cor_day1_PMSL_MSL_G2NHX.png


http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS_vsdb/allmodel/daily/cor/cor_day3_PMSL_MSL_G2NHX.png


http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS_vsdb/allmodel/daily/cor/cor_day5_PMSL_MSL_G2NHX.png


http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS_vsdb/allmodel/daily/cor/cor_day8_PMSL_MSL_G2NHX.png


http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS_vsdb/allmodel/daily/cor/cor_day10_PMSL_MSL_G2NHX.png


MY THOUGHTS The most complex part of today's output is the way each model handles the complex situation of the Low pressure areas slipping across the South of the UK and the way they remove this away early next week with a period of cold North winds and the eventual High pressure ridge which follows with very cold frosty air. This period as it stands currently shows rain most likely in the South with a messy mix of rain and snow over Wales and the Midlands before all areas turn bright, frosty and cold with some snow showers for a day or two near Northern and Eastern windward coasts early next week. There is then some further disagreements between the models as to how they remove that High pressure away to the SE and East as the milder and stronger Westerly winds moving down across the UK from midweek. Some output shows a strong build of pressure being maintained to the East which could prevent much progress of any milder winds with even the chance from some output suggesting further trough disruption late next week delaying the progress of milder air and resulting in a couple more cold and raw days before it seems a unison message towards the end of the forecast period that mild westerly winds win out. So a very complex set-up this morning none of which show anything particularly dramatic anywhere but could result in subtle differences weather and temperature wise day to day dependant upon which way the dice falls throughout the period and particularly later next week.       


Next Update Friday February 12th 2016 from 09:00


Martin G
Kilmersdon Radstock Bath Somerset



Look up my New Facebook Weather Page  for all the latest up to the minute weather stories as they happen
David M Porter
11 February 2016 09:47:53


I know its out in F1 but if the PV verifies over Siberia around 23rd Feb, then the effect of the current SSW which by the way has a few more days to reach its peak, will most certainly have an impact on north western Europe.  I think I read somewhere that it is possible for the SSW to change the rotation of the PV from anti to clockwise, now that would be interesting.  


 



Originally Posted by: Phil24 


I wonder if it's possible that the SSW may be adding to the usual amount of uncertainty in the model output just now when looking further ahead. As noted above, there appear to be suggestions now of heights possibly rising over Scandi, which I don't remember seeing in the model runs a few days ago.


FWIW, it wouldn't surprise me at all if March turns out to be somewhat different to the winter we've had, I've seen it happen before.


Lenzie, Glasgow

"Let us not take ourselves too seriously. None of us has a monopoly on wisdom, and we must always be ready to listen and respect other points of view."- Queen Elizabeth II 1926-2022
The Beast from the East
11 February 2016 09:59:27

http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2016021106/gfs-0-96.png?6


GFS holding firm, slight upgrade


"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
The Beast from the East
11 February 2016 10:06:39

shame the jet is so strong or we could have got the high in a much better position


"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
The Beast from the East
11 February 2016 10:07:58

http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2016021106/gfs-1-120.png?6


better cold pool anyway


"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
Essan
11 February 2016 10:52:01

GFS 06z looking very interesting for some next week .....   Though I would expect some changes yet!  


Andy
Evesham, Worcs, Albion - 35m asl
Weather & Earth Science News 

Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job - DNA
roger63
11 February 2016 11:17:20

Latest fax for Sunday  line show 528 isotherm in the channel -pity that there  doesn't seem to be much precipitation around!


http://www.meteociel.fr/modeles/ukmo2.php?ech=84&carte=2000

tallyho_83
11 February 2016 11:22:51

06Z CHART - SHOWS this band of rain/snow (on it's leading edge) looks like taking more of a Southerly track now!??



Home Location - Kellands Lane, Okehampton, Devon (200m ASL)
---------------------------------------
Sean Moon
Magical Moon
www.magical-moon.com


nsrobins
11 February 2016 16:02:34

Yes another tweak South and from the grapevine I expect much more of a Scandy high this run.


Neil
Fareham, Hampshire 28m ASL (near estuary)
Stormchaser, Member TORRO
warrenb
11 February 2016 16:09:35
We could be sleepwalking into a cold spell here
LA2B MeridFlowEuro09
11 February 2016 17:14:29

GFS and UKMO, it looks like later Tuesday and early Wednesday 16-17 February Starting with Cold NE winds far SE UK, all other areas High Pressure that means the Milder Atlantic High Azores one based 1000 miles north of Azores Islands!!, Yeh at Wednesday 17th, the Northwest to North Atlantic then spreading to UK that Low, mild Tuesday night but this will quickly be squeezed out by the Cold part of the Northwest to N Atlantic then West to S UK tracking Low By 12z onwards it will turn colder with NW winds in Western UK ahem.


Sunday and Monday a fairly dry Northeast flow but it will bring Seasonal Cold airmass with it- nothing groundbreaking as far as getting any snow but those lucky may get to play with it, the SE side in particular as well as SW and S Central UK, increasing wintry showers on Monday 15th Feb, NE winds across Central E and South SE UK.  Western and NW parts UK High moves across as a Deep NNW Atlantic Low pushes this high P slide SE to UK p.m Monday and Tuesday next week.


T144 nothing pointing to sharp drop in temperature - but after Midday Wednesday onwards through Thursday next week colder as SW Central W Europe Low moves closer to North France, Split the Azores High ridge sends it East to Scandy E NE mid side Europe and it looks like merges with another very warm High from ESE Europe area...


long story cut short... B U M P.😅🌧💤😇🌤🌫❄️.


Climate is warming up, Scotland and N Ireland and North England still often gets some Winter frost, ice and snow, November to March, but the SE and South UK including S Central England and Wales, together with the West and North through the year, they sometimes get more rain than London and S SE England, where some longer dry fine spells without much heavy rain is seen every year.

The North Atlantic Sea often gets some much Colder Wintry conditions from November to March Months, and Mild SW and South winds tend to be more frequent over the East and SE of North Atlantic Sea, as the Azores High tends to stay in charge. 

With this warmth and heat, the Central and South UK has become mostly free of snow and frost.
JACKO4EVER
11 February 2016 17:40:24

Usual suspects cold spell now on the horizon. Should be snow for those up north and those with elevation. Not sure about lowland England and Wales- marginal at times though there should be some frosts about. Next week, well jam tamara and all that.

Gooner
11 February 2016 17:59:09


Possibilty of snow from this set up


 


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Gooner
11 February 2016 18:01:52

Weather type GFS Fr 19.02.2016 00 GMT


J F F of course


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Gandalf The White
11 February 2016 18:02:15


 


Possibilty of snow from this set up


 


Originally Posted by: Gooner 


Just for you Marcus... 



Location: South Cambridgeshire
130 metres ASL
52.0N 0.1E


Essan
11 February 2016 18:05:12

I dont bloody believe it!

GFS has heavy snow for the West Midlands next Thursday ........  The one day I do not want it as I have a Runrig concert to get to in Birmingham that evening


Andy
Evesham, Worcs, Albion - 35m asl
Weather & Earth Science News 

Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job - DNA
picturesareme
11 February 2016 18:09:42
Posting snow charts for over a week away and labelling it JJF 😕 I think this all a little in bad taste to be honest given how crap this winter has been for cold & snow.
Maunder Minimum
11 February 2016 18:17:16


I dont bloody believe it!

GFS has heavy snow for the West Midlands next Thursday ........  The one day I do not want it as I have a Runrig concert to get to in Birmingham that evening


Originally Posted by: Essan 


I wouldn't worry Essan - it is too far away to be taken seriously.


I would seriously love it to materialise though (sorry about Runrig) !


New world order coming.
Robertski
11 February 2016 18:25:35

Posting snow charts for over a week away and labelling it JJF 😕 I think this all a little in bad taste to be honest given how crap this winter has been for cold & snow.

Originally Posted by: picturesareme 


 


He always does it. May he keep doing it, one day it may actually happen that way.tongue-out

Essan
11 February 2016 18:33:29


 


I wouldn't worry Essan - it is too far away to be taken seriously.


I would seriously love it to materialise though (sorry about Runrig) !


Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum 



I just hope it gets put back 24 hours, then I get it all    But fully expect the carrot to be gone tomorrow ...


Andy
Evesham, Worcs, Albion - 35m asl
Weather & Earth Science News 

Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job - DNA
JACKO4EVER
11 February 2016 18:33:43

Posting snow charts for over a week away and labelling it JJF 😕 I think this all a little in bad taste to be honest given how crap this winter has been for cold & snow.

Originally Posted by: picturesareme 


not having a go at you pics but it's posters like Marcus that keep everyone's morale up during the inept winter months like we have just endured. And it is model output discussion after all. We all know snowmageddon charts never come off- but what's wrong with a little eye candy every now and then ? 😀

Gooner
11 February 2016 18:34:22


I might be a tad cold


J F F


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


doctormog
11 February 2016 18:35:29


 


 


He always does it. May he keep doing it, one day it may actually happen that way.tongue-out


Originally Posted by: Robertski 


http://modeles2.meteociel.fr/modeles_gfs/runs/2016021112/30-779UK.GIF?11-12 


I'll let you all know how it pans out as I'm sure you'll be on tenterhooks


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