Dew, if it's any comfort, you (not alone I must say) are one of the obviously really good ones here.

To those who's internet persona I don't find obviously really good, I'll just say I actually suspect you are good as well

Yes, I do.

Like several here I don't have my own family. I do regret that, but it doesn't dominate my thoughts. Those of you who do have your own family are lucky, those of us us who don't can (I hope) be good, rewarded by life and characterful in other ways.

Depression. Luckily I don't think suffer, I'm not sure why - but it would seem an unnecessary additional kicking for not have achieved in a standard way, and i think I'm the sort to say 'I'm just not having that!'.

Christmas. I see it as a way of getting to the longest day - even tonight sunset was a little later. but, family will be around and we'll have a nice meal and chill.

Old age. Now that is the potential real bugger for us single ones. I live in hope though.

A really interesting thread. I still have both my parents. They both have relatively good health, knee replacements not withstanding. In there early 70's. I treasure every moment with them. They gave me and my brother great Christmases in our childhood and we're reciprocating them now. Both my kids are at Uni, indeed my daughter is in Japan this year for Christmas and we all normally spend Christmas day together. I lost my nan on Christmas Eve 20 years ago, so it's a bitter-sweet time for my dad (all the grand parents have since passed). I love Christmas, but I know one day, there will be that empty chair. The thought makes me tear up now. But, that makes me even more determined to enjoy not only Christmas, but any time I spend with my parents, extended family and friends.

My partners father has advance dementia and she's finding it tough, so I do see it from the other side as well and it must be tough to see others having fun. But she, like me ensures she makes the most of her mum and my family. The older I get, the more I withdraw from the material world. Having friends and family altogether gives me the greatest sense of well-being and happiness.

Sorry for the ramble..

This is one of the most thought provoking and remarkable threads I've ever had the privilege to read.

It's really sad to read about the challenges and problems others are having to endure.  The eloquence and heartfelt comments are moving and inspiring.

Like most people I have memories of Christmas as a child and then through my teenage years, always with parents and brothers and generally with grandparents on Christmas Day or Boxing Day.  Even when I left home we managed to be together for Christmas. When I got married we mostly hosted the family for Christmas and that continued for many years. My mother died over twelve years ago and the first two or three Chrstmases were a little difficult but time is a great healer, as they say.  My father lives in Canada so we've only spoken via Skype most years although we did fly over to spend Christmas with him just a few years ago.  He's now in his nineties and I must admit to thinking in recent years when I write out the Christmas card that it might be the last one I send.  

If possible I think you have to just accept that it's part of life: you grow up, you build your own life, get married and have children. They in turn grow up. Somewhere along the journey you realise that things you thought were constants in your life aren't and that you're on the same journey as everyone you know and have known.  At times I can get a little nostalgic and emotional but I'm aware of it and aware that nothing good comes from it. I think you have to savour the memories you have and not dwell on them if they get you down. Easier said than done, I accept.

As this is a weather forum I'll share one strong memory: spending Boxing Day with my parents and brothers at our grandparents' place in London.  We left early as the snow started to fall; my father commented that it would no doubt all be gone by morning. The year..... 1962. 

Enjoy what you have; don't take it for granted.  If you have made a difference in this world then your presence has been worthwhile.

I hope everyone has as happy a Christmas as they can, with family or friends or both. Whatever you do don't put unnecessary pressure on yourself: really it isn't about over-spending, over-eating and over-drinking.

I completely agree. TWO really is a wonderful place.

Merry Christmas to you all. 

Must have been incredible to live through that winter. Assuming you had adequate heating etc

Maybe for the Weather forum but yes, it was in hindsight remarkable. But at the time it was just each day cold with snow everywhere. I don’t think you worry about the cold much when you’re a kid.

I did suffer for a while in my mid forties, when our daughter went to college and it was suggested I had the ‘flown the nest syndrome’, although maybe it was the mid life crisis that I referred to earlier.  I felt a great weight pushing me into a black hole that I could see no way out of.  I knew I was there and I knew my constant dark mood was irrational but it wouldn’t go away.  I couldn’t pinpoint a time when that dark cloud descended or anything that had triggered it.  I could see no happiness in the future and no light in the darkness, however much I tried to turn my thoughts around.  I think I gave up trying eventually because the effort was too much.

Nothing else had changed in my previously happy life, other than Gemma growing into a lovely young independant adult, which is all I really wanted for all my kids.  I didn’t really talk to anyone about it than occasionally saying I felt a bit fed up - a gross understatement!  I didn’t see a doctor because I didn’t know how to explain it and thought it would sound trivial and silly coming from me, the strong independant woman!  I was alone!

Hubby suggested a bit of winter sunshine so we booked a family holiday to Florida.  I couldn’t even get excited about that as I knew it would just be a temporary fix.  All I could think was that I might enjoy it for two weeks but then I’d have to come home to the black mood.  

I did enjoy the holiday and it may have helped a little but it wasn’t a miracle cure.  Fortunately my darkness lifted, just as it had descended, with no trigger and no time I could pinpoint.  I just realised one day that I hadn’t been in darkness for a while.  It had lasted for only a few months and thankfully it never came back.  So I’m one of the lucky ones!  It’s also one of the experiences in my life that I don’t regret or wouldn’t change because it’s helped me understand depression.

I know that whatever anyone else says, won’t make a sufferer better but I think anyone suffering will feel better for talking about it.  When you’re in a dark place, you’re the only one there but others have been there before and know what it’s like, so you’re not alone!  

My parents used to talk about getting Coal for the fires as there was no central heating  and filling hot water bottles to keep warm. They also had an outside toilet which used to freeze up.

Remarkable what we take for granted these days

Sorry OT! 

Great thread, and I particularly resonate with Saint's thoughts on the matter. Christmas and New Year is a time when you inevitably look back, not only the year that has passed but also on all our years, including our childhoods, how things have changed, and who isn't there anymore.

I am very lucky compared to those who have lost all their family. My parents and my wife's parents are all still around, we are both eldest siblings and I especially have a large family - 14 of us will be in Cirencester for Christmas Day. I hope that my children will look back on their childhood Christmases as I do on mine.

I have been around on TWO for nearly 17 years now, and I think my age bracket - those of us in our late 40s, is probably the single most represented age group on here. Most of you have also been on here for that amount of time. I have met a few of you, most of you haven't met anyone else from TWO, but I'm sure you'll agree that we feel like we know many of each other. The TWO meetups of the previous decade have stopped happening in the same way that others described meetups with friends that will now "never happen", and many of those I did meet no longer post. Similarly, it's easy to feel wistful about the days of old on TWO. It's a cheesy thing to say, but I'm sure many of you will agree that TWO is like one big family. 

I’ve just read an article about stress levels being really high at Christmas and it mentions the things we’ve been discussing and the advice is:

Don’t have too many expectations.  For many of us, Christmas evokes memories of past ones and we may have many unrealistic expectations. Recognising expectations are potential disappointments frees us up to enjoy it as it is.

I think that’s sound advice. I’m a born organiser and ex-perfectionist, all year round but more so at Christmas!  I used to stress over getting things ‘just right’ but learned it was more fun for everyone if I just set things up initially and let them flow in their own way.  Nobody else notices if things are not perfect because the ‘perfect plan’ is only in your head and nobody else sees it.  If there’s a mishap, laugh it off and get on with it because you’ll remember it in future years and laugh about it even more.

I have lots of funny memories of mishaps.  Red Christmas pudding because Mum forgot to take the red paper off before cooking it. Plastic tainted turkey because she left the bag of giblets in.  Cooking my sister’s turkey because her oven broke on Christmas Day!  Two years ago at our house, my sister’s mum in law scattering peppercorns on her smoked salmon starter and all over the table when she unscrewed the pepper grinder by mistake.  No problem!  No stress!  Nobody died or got injured!  I had a spare starter to replace the peppered one!  Oh, how l’ve Changed!  And how much more fun it is!

My favourite Christmas movie is National Lampoons Christmas Vacation. It’s total chaos but the message is spot on.  It’s not what you do, it’s who you do it with and it’s about fun rather than routine and perfection. Anything goes as long as it’s enjoyable.

Relax!  It’s Christmas!  Just let it happen!  

I can report that in our privileged part of the country fighting broken out yesterday in the Waitrose car park. It is not a joke. The car park was full and when a space became free several women started competing for it. In the end they got out of their cars and a fight ensued. Today it will be the pushing and scrambling for cut price turkeys. That has also led to "problems" in years gone by, generally with men getting aggressive with each other. What a sad state of affairs.

Caz, your attitude to life is a true inspiration. Can't even begin to imagine what you have suffered regarding the loss of your son, but that you continue to stay positive about life is incredible. 

Depression is a strange thing. Was diagnosed with 'chronic depression' years back and was given a big load of pills, which thankful I had no inclination to take. The way I see it, the inherent morbidity of my mind is just in my mind only, and thankfully, my mind is able to understand that and deal with it, and in a twisted and paradoxical sort of way, I think seeing the world through such a distorted lens helps you understand the world more for what it is and in a more understanding way. 

Another good contribution Caz.

We've had some similar mishaps, particularly leaving the bag of giblets in the turkey.... always check both ends.... 

Fortunately we discovered it part way through, although removing a warm bag of giblets is worse than removing a cold one...

Have a great Christmas.

Christmas for me for a long time has been a difficult time. 3 years ago it was made much more so. My father who had been ill with dementia for 3 years passed away just 3 weeks before Christmas 2015. I had the awful process of having to have his funeral just 1 week before Christmas Eve 2015.

I had always been very close to my father and all this shot me to pieces from which I still haven't got over all this time later on. To have read a eulogy to someone you have been very close to especially a parent with a Christmas tree just 6 feet away from you is a most dreadful experience. It really is.

I have been looking after my mother ever since. As time passes I feel these things however bad are a part of life. You don't get over it - You come to terms with it - The emotional pain dulls over time. Well thats how I feel about it now.

I have read other peoples contributions to this excellent thread - and I can see that I'm not alone in having bad things to contend with over Christmas.

I'd likew to say a big thanks to all those who have contributed to this thread on here. Indeed you're a great bunch all of us here on TWO. This is a great forum and it's good so many have been able to share their thoughts.

Thanks to all of you.

HT, I understand exactly.  When I lost my son, my mum took my hands in hers, looked me straight in the eye and said,  ‘Carol, it does get easier to bear’.   That was the most comforting thing she could have said and she of all people knew, because three years earlier she lost a son, my younger brother.  

She was right too!  There isn’t a day I don’t miss him but there isn’t a day I don’t bring back happy memories of him.  We were very close, he was my first born and was like me in many ways, so we had a good understanding.  He never married and he always said it was because he couldn’t find another woman like me.  

He actually died two days before my birthday, which he’d absolutely hate if he knew!  If that makes sense!  People bought me cards but nobody wished me ‘happy birthday’ because of course it wasn’t that year, but it has been for the past two years and it will be every year in future.  I had to wait four weeks to arrange his funeral as there was a post mortem, due to his sudden death.  

The morning of his funeral I had a call from the hospital asking if I could take my mum in for a test the following day.  My husband and I took her and we were told she had terminal cancer.  She died exactly five years to the day my brother died.  

But all these dates are only dates on a calendar.  We’re without those we’ve lost every day of the year.  No more so on anniversaries.  Dates really aren’t significant to our loss, or to getting on with life.  That’s the way I see it and it helps!

I am going to enjoy Christmas, especially as I know my son and mum would want me to.  They wouldn’t want me to be sad!  I wouldn’t want anyone to be sad if I died.  Would you?  

Merry Christmas everyone!  Remember, it’s just another day.  But it’s a day in your life, so live it!  

This is one of the best threads I've ever seen on TWO...the contributions have been incredible.

My single enduring memory over the last few years has been chatting with Dougie every Christmas Eve knowing he was going to spend Christmas Day alone.

Never forgotten my friend.

A peaceful time to all on TWO. 

In the last decade, there have been a couple of Christmases when someone who was quite a close friend of both me and my family passed away. Just before Xmas 2008 a man whom I had got to know pretty well in a model railway enthusiast's group both me and my dad are members of passed away from a brain tumour aged 69. We had only learned about 6 weeks or so earlier that he hadn't been keeping well but had not known just how serious his condition was. The three years later, a few days before Christmas 2011, another man who was a personal friend of me & my dad who was a member of a different model railway club died after losing a brave battle against skin cancer. He was 74

The only occasion I can clearly remember when a relation of mine passed away close to the festive season was when an uncle of mine died suddenly on Friday 4th January 2008, after suffering a heart attack. Very sad though his passing was, he did at least get to see one final festive season.

Good to see you on here again John, and I will also remember Dougie this Christmas.

Merry Christmas to you too, and to all TWO members.

Yes, Dougie’s in my heart too!  An inspiration and a lesson to us all.  It was a pleasure knowing him and he braved life right to the end!  He just got on with it!  

Tesco here was  total chaos with no trolleys either and the morons going mad 

Obviously I don't have kids or family etc, but I would never behave like this to make the "perfect Xmas" as if it was a matter of life and death

The pub was terrible as well. Full of idiots who look like they only drink once a year. 

I cant wait for this nonsense to be over