From Radio 5 live last night:

4 years ago our under 17 team won some European competion or other. Since then only 3 play regular Premier league football, the rest are either loaned out or play little. What was not said was how that compared to other European leagues or whether the players were actually anygood lol

That injury time goal could really cost the US dear. I can see Ghana beating Portugal and Germany turning it on to win by 2 or 3

I'd rather Ghana went through than the US.

Although, the dream scenario would be both Ghana and USA winning by enough goals to both progress and knock out Germany & Portugal

The players aren't really kicking on, as in most cases their careers aren't being developed by the clubs.

Clubs would love to find a new home-produced top-quality Premier League player from every tranche of juniors they bring through their academies. But they're under the pressure of falling off in overall team quality and so demand instant results from players promoted into the first team. Luck plays a big part too.

Look at John Flanagan at Liverpool. Very promising youngster, gets a few first team games here and there 2/3 years ago, doesn't look anything special, drops back into the reserves, gets injured, recovers but doesn't look like he'll make the break-through. A matter of time before he's moved on, to try to pick up the threads of a career at Shrewsbury Town or somewhere.

A catalogue of injuries to our fullbacks means he gets another chance in the first team last season. Puts in a brilliant display against an in-form Everton on the opposite side to his natural position, keeps his place, shows he does indeed have the quality for the PL. Our LB gets ruled out for the season and his on-loan understudy proves rubbish, ends up playing the majority of games since his return. Gets picked as a reserve to the England WC squad.

Every Liverpool fan really wants him at the club. A diamond. Yet most fans would love us to sign two world class full backs

PS - the captain of the 2010 England u-17 team is a lad called Conor Coady. Been on Liverpool's books since he was a sprog, captained all age groups at the club, plays CH or DM. Can't break into the first team. Spent last season on loan at Sheff Utd. Did OK, but didn't pull up trees or anything. Reports that Liverpool will listen to offers for him.

He could turn out to be another Alan Hansen or Sami Hyppia. If a club without the spending power (and pressure to compete at the very top) of Liverpool had him, I suspect they'd guide him into being first team regular and we could see him develop to his full potential, albeit making the odd mistake that all developing players make. At Liverpool (or City, Man U , Chavski, etc), he isn't considered ready to be a regular, these clubs believe they cannot afford to have an apprentice in such a key position.

Flags still flying.. Orange socks are being worn.... So.. Hup Hup Holland once again... It Is the Wife's homeland team...

Turnip Taylor backs 'Arry:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27975727

Isn't one of the problems that as soon as any young player starts displaying a degree of talent, one of the big clubs buy him up and sit him on the bench for the next 2 or 3 years, so that no-one else can play him .....

That's the point I made earlier in the thread.

There are countless incidences of this, with promising youngsters disappearing off the football map after going to a rich club too early in their careers. Brian thinks they should just take the megabucks contract dangled in front of them; I think they should make a decision based on what would benefit their career development, given that they'd be on multiple-times the average salary at a smaller club where they'll get more opportunity to develop.

I said I don't blame them. One injury can and does finish a professional sportsperson's career. The problem is partly related to the structure of the game. As Swann inadvertently pointed out a test match cricketer earns £1 million per year. How much does a journeyman county cricketer earn? Peanuts in comparison. In football the rewards on offer in the league and Champions League are unsurpassed and mean the incentives to play for your country are less. 

LOL, a bit like a bloke called Coates, who......er....came on and played gainst....er.Engerrland.

Didn't watch a game over the weekend, just couldn't be bothered. Weather was great, I was in North Devon and good wine was there for the drinking. Don't get me wrong, I've subsequently caught up on results but this time last week I was checking BBC etc for updates and taking it all in. Now, I'm not even sure if I can be bothered to go on the early finish work jolly tomorrow.

Bloody football. two crushing blows in the last 8 weeks.

Tidied.

I almost came over emotional when I read this. But then my brain engaged.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27967383

He won the 'Best Young Player' award at the Copa America in 2011, looking like the best Centre Half prospect of his generation. Signs for Liverpool, defends like Peter Crouch in callipers and lead boots.

He did his cruciate (playing for Uruguay) and we loaned him back to Nacionale to help him try to get fit for the WC, which he did.

Netherlands vs Chile coming up. Now this is a game I've been looking forward to.

Of course, it could end up being totally pants.

RE Englands Demise and Future

One idea could be to follow the ECB`s way and identify promosing youngsters say 16 to 20 and indroduce central contracts where a squad is built that specifically play for England with a limit on games for thier parent clubs.

Regular friendlies,say two or three every month,against other nations and those players primarily are first and foremost England players,training and playing together the same as at a club but more importantly growing and developing together.

It worked for English cricket and its an idea worth trying,after all if nothing is done what`s happened at this w/c will become the norm.

We are going backwards whereas others,a great example is the usa,are moving forward.

The difference say between us and the usa from 4 years ago could not be more opposite.

Van Gaal parking the bus after just 5 mins. I hope this isn't indicative of how United will play next season. Well actually I do.

So basically, Van Gaal's game plan appears to be to park the bus and counter attack employing route 1.

So somewhat a timeout for me this weekend as I was getting a bit of a World Cup burnout.  My ESPN app on the TV is delayed by about 1 minutes to live broadcast so yesterday I could do some gardening at same time as watching the game.  Every time I would hear my neighbours cheer/shout/moan* (delete as apppropriate) I would duck my head insode and see the replay, a kind of live highlights viewing of the game.

As for England, I think there are several causes/solutions identified in this thread, all of which have merit in some way or other. Certainly, we have the talent coming through at youth level, and it is really about how do we get them to kick on and become first teamers at their clubs and also stop clubs from monopolising youth to prevent competition. Some of the key considerations:

1. Limits on foreigners in match day squads and first XI for the game.

2. Exposue of various football styles (time abroad?).

3. Eradicate fear of failure.

4. Instilled pride of pulling the national shirt on.  Look at other global superstars. Many of them are earning megabucks but still want to perform for their national sides and wear the countries shirt.

5. Salary caps.

6. Tough penalties for teams that break the rules. None of this 'wishy washy can't hurt the elite clubs but can shaft the smaller ones as much as we like' attitudes.  This may also make the leagues more competitive and narrow the widening gap between the rich and poor. Let's face it, most of our supported teams (mine included -Leeds) will never compete competitively at the top of the Premier League again.

I am sure there are a bunch more ideas touched up on that I have missed but it is clear that no single measure will work in isolation, it has to be a whole and holistic redefinition of football in England.  No-one has the stomach for it and sadly, the status quo will remain.  Yours sincerely, A well and truly jaded football fan.