Remove ads from site

Polar Low
13 November 2014 21:32:56

look at those live dew points right now in southern england updates every 15 min


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Reurmetd.html


 

Brian Gaze
13 November 2014 21:48:07


all so thinking prx is the Parallel  on model statistics.


correct me if im wrong.


Originally Posted by: Polar Low 


I'm not sure if it's PRX or PRHW14.


I noticed there were big differences in the rainfall forecasts for this Sunday from the GFS op and parallel runs:


 


See: http://www.theweatheroutlook.com/twodata/datmdlout.aspx


PS: For those who don't know, the GFS is scheduled to undergo another upgrade next year. The horiz and vert resolutions will be increased again and changes are planned to GENS I think.


 


Brian Gaze
Berkhamsted
TWO Buzz - get the latest news and views 
"I'm not socialist, I know that. I don't believe in sharing my money." - Gary Numan
Polar Low
13 November 2014 21:53:37

Brian I think? PRHW14. is the current upgraded trial gfs run that we dont see


 


 

Brian Gaze
13 November 2014 22:09:21


Brian I think? PRHW14. is the current upgraded trial gfs run that we dont see


Originally Posted by: Polar Low 


The only thing is PRX is scoring higher than PRHW14 at the moment which is why I thought it could be the other way round.


Brian Gaze
Berkhamsted
TWO Buzz - get the latest news and views 
"I'm not socialist, I know that. I don't believe in sharing my money." - Gary Numan
Gooner
13 November 2014 23:05:19


 


Theres only so many times you can say the outlook is wet, windy and mild. Hopefully every week for the next three months 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 


Get your boat out then Matthew


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Stormchaser
13 November 2014 23:55:09

I see the 12z runs brought a vast majority of boring runs with HP from the SW becoming a blocking feature over the UK while tending to favour locations that bring either low cloud or mist and fog to the UK.


The one major exception is clearly the ECM 12z op run, which is the result of the jet being less strong and flat days 6 and 7, and that in turn is the result of LP to our west becoming cut off on day 5 and sinking south on day 6, which prevents the new, larger low emerging off the U.S. from phasing with it and giving the jet stream a serious boost.


 


ECM is rarely far out at 5 days range, but for the majority vote to win out - which includes the 12z and 18z GFSP runs - that has to be the case, and really the final votes ought to have been cast by around half past 6 tomorrow evening. I'm actually left sitting on the fence at this point in time - that's how much I respect ECM's output out to 5 days range.


As it happens, the 18z GFS and GFSP runs take that LP a little further south days 5-6 than the respective 12z runs did, though it still isn't enough to prevent phasing with the upstream trough. Still, the trend is a marked one and it would only take a similar size of shift on tomorrow's 00z GFS runs to bring them close to what ECM's produced today.


 


If you have any problems or queries relating to TWO you can Email [email protected]

https://twitter.com/peacockreports 
2023's Homeland Extremes:
T-Max: 30.2°C 9th Sep (...!) | T-Min: -7.1°C 22nd & 23rd Jan | Wettest Day: 25.9mm 2nd Nov | Ice Days: 1 (2nd Dec -1.3°C in freezing fog)
Keep Calm and Forecast On
DEW
  • DEW
  • Advanced Member
14 November 2014 08:01:01

After the next few days, with the current low decaying over France, GFS looks like predicting boring southwesterlies for the foreseeable future, with NW Scotland and N Ireland bearing the brunt of the rain and wind - though occasionally a secondary feature (not well enough defined to call it a low) peps up the weather in the south.


 


As for winter, nil desperandum - this is only traditional November weather.


War does not determine who is right, only who is left - Bertrand Russell

Chichester 12m asl
doctor snow
14 November 2014 08:05:12
hey take a look at weather web tv the weather at the moment is just like 2009 10 the charts are the same now ;to many charts to post go have look .its going to be wet and wind its november! its not going to get cold till about mid december
idj20
14 November 2014 08:28:17

The outputs certainly are struggling to get a grip on things beyond the 144 hours range (well, more so than usual) with ECM showing a deep low pressure slicing through the UK on Sat 22nd Nov: http://expert-images.weatheronline.co.uk/daten/proficharts/en/ecmwf/2014/11/14/basis00/ukuk/pslv/14112300_1400.gif while the new fangled GFS is showing high pressure being the dominant feature for the same time frame: http://expert-images.weatheronline.co.uk/daten/proficharts/en/gfs25/2014/11/14/basis00/ukuk/pslv/14112300_1400.gif

Couldn't get more contrasting outputs than that. Mind you, that is right at the far end of the hi-res time frame and thus subject to changes, but I'm willing to bet that eventually FGS will match ECM's solution, especially if the jet stream profile is anything to go by.


Folkestone Harbour. 
GIBBY
14 November 2014 08:38:28

HERE IS MY LATEST ANALYSIS FROM THE OUTPUTS OF THE WEATHER COMPUTER PREDICTION MODELS FOR TWO WEEKS FROM 8AM TODAY FRIDAY NOVEMBER 14TH 2014.


NEXT UPDATE SATURDAY NOVEMBER 15TH 08:00


THE CURRENT GENERAL SITUATION A large depression covers the Atlantic ocean with the centre filling slowly and drifting towards SW England over the weekend. An active trough will slowly clear NE to lie over NE Scotland tomorrow.


MODELS-2 WEEK HEADLINE  Remaining largely unsettled with rain at times, heavy in places, especially later in the NW and coupled with spells of strong winds in near to average temperatures for all.


THE JET STREAM ENSEMBLE FORECAST The GFS Jet Stream Ensemble forecast is shown to weaken over the coming days splitting as one arm blows East across the Arctic while the other remains diffuse to the South of the UK. The Southern arm then becomes the dominant force again later next week, crossing the UK before moving further North around our neck of the hemispher to lie North of the UK at the end of the run.


GFS OPERATIONAL The general message from the GFS operational this morning is for mild and changeable weather maintained across the UK after a quieter chillier period early next week as Low pressure becomes slack across the South. A much stronger Westerly flow develops thereafter with gales in the North and West with rain, heavy at times too for all though as pressure is shown to build to the South for a while at the start of Week 2 the South could see drier and mild conditions for a time.


THE GFS PARALLEL RUN The GFS Parallel run is shown to become much more dominant across the UK in Week 2 as after a week of unsettled and sometimes wet and windy weather replaced by dry and fine weather in light winds. A warm High is shown to engulf the UK in Week 2 with cloudy and misty conditions likely at the surface. Then very late in the run more unsettled and colder weather looks poised to come down from the North with rain and wind in tow moving North to South.


THE GFS ENSEMBLES.  The GFS Ensembles are very similar to the operational run in sequence and trend with the run ending in High pressure having built across the UK with some frost and fog patches replacing the wet and windy Atlantic based weather in the preceding days.


UKMO. UKMO today continues to show another Low pressure out to the West through the middle of next week filling slowly again as winds stay largely light and from a mild Southerly quarter. Rain will occur on occasion but with some drier spells too especially over the East where some parts could stay dry with some fog at night.


THE FAX CHARTS  The Fax Charts show a gradually slacker airflow developing across the UK as a parent Low to the West drifts towards the South of the UK and fills by the start of next week. Troughs to the NE persist and showery ones near the coasts of the South will continue to blight the far South in slowly less mild weather with fog in places.


GEM  GEM also shows a sustained period of slacker winds as Low pressure areas to the West fill as they move SE towards the SW of the UK with a light South or SE flow likely with rain and showers more restricted to near an old trough close to the NE at first and the far South throughout. Late in the run the Atlantic ratchets up a few gears with stronger winds and rain spreading steadily East across the UK by Day 10.


NAVGEM NAVGEM shows changeable conditions over the coming week as the High pressure block to the NE collapses later with a shift in distribution of rain and wind moving more towards the NW later as a SW flow develops across the UK in fairly mild conditions.


ECM  ECM this morning has again shifted from it's last run with the unsettled and slack pressure gradient over the UK through much of next week being replaced by a real bullseye of a storm system over the UK by next weekend delivering severe gales and heavy rain for all as a result, all this following the collapse of the High pressure block to the NE by then. This then sets up a strong Westerly flow thereafter with further troughs carrying rain and strong winds quickly East over all areas at times in average temperatures.


THE ECM ENSEMBLES   The Ensembles point to a strong chance of a deep depression lying close to SW Iceland in 10 days time with a strong SW airflow covering the UK in what would produce rain at times for all in relatively mild conditions.


NOTABLE TREND CHANGES FROM PREVIOUS RUNS The trend continues to show variations on a theme of basically mild and changeable weather in a largely Westerly flow with rain at times, the emphasis of which shifts more towards the North and West with time.


MY THOUGHTS   The main message delivered from the models this morning continue to suggest that the UK will see little if any particularly cold conditions over the next few weeks as the basic flow of winds remain from either Southerly or Westerly latitudes. In the short term the High pressure block still dominant to the NE prevent deep Low pressure areas crossing the UK from the West with attendant fronts and rain stalling over the UK and delivering the most unsettled conditions toward the South and West. Later in the period most output suggests the block to the NE collapses and pressure may become higher towards a position South or East of the UK shifting the emphasis of rain towards the North and West but also permitting more mobility across the North Atlantic as a stronger Jet flow is likely to lie across the UK by then powering up deep Low pressure areas to the NW with rain and gales for all at times as a result. The position of any higher pressure to the South of the UK will be indicative of how much of the wind and rain from these Lows affect the South but a more certain fact is that if High pressure does develop there it will be mild for all and once developed can become a real fixture for a sustained period but as for now this is a minority view. My own personal viewpoint is that it will stay relatively mild for the foreseeable future with many ingredients for cold becoming increasingly displaced with time shifting the emphasis of concern towards how much rain will be falling on already saturated ground over the period. I think what we are lacking this season is cool High pressure which can sometimes develop at this time of year introducing early Winter cold to our shores in the shape of frost and fog failing to clear by day rather than cold weather from any other source this early on. However, as things stand apart from the risk of cool fogs this weekend in some parts there is little sign of any significant chill for the UK shown from any source today.


Martin G
Kilmersdon Radstock Bath Somerset



Look up my New Facebook Weather Page  for all the latest up to the minute weather stories as they happen
Cumbrian Snowman
14 November 2014 09:21:55

I am getting my winter tyres fitted today -  lets see if that helps the current setup !!


Either way they were good last year in the wet


 


Charmhills
14 November 2014 09:26:07

Looking unsettled of not very unsettled depending on which model you look at, especially the ECM 00z.


Loughborough, EM.

Knowledge is power, ignorance is weakness.

Duane.
Stormchaser
14 November 2014 09:41:56

Precipitation EURO4 Fr 14.11.2014 15 GMT  Precipitation GFS Fr 14.11.2014 15 GMT


I admire Euro4's ability to model the effects of an onshore flow creating convergence that leads to convective development and showers moving inland. Compare that with GFS's output and you can really see the benefits of having a higher resolution 


 


Now, what about the question of 'to phase or not to phase?' that was presented last night?


Well, ECM has shifted towards GFS and now shows interaction between low pressure to our west and another exiting Canada, but whereas GFS (below-left) has the former trough being absorbed into the circulation of the latter, ECM (below right) positions the low to the west of the UK further south than GFS (but not by as much as on the 12z run of yesterday), and this puts in in a favourable position to not only retain its independence but intensify into a fairly potent system (larger image on following row).


No chart available for the selected hour. Many charts start at 3 hours ahead, so if you have 0 hours selected try stepping forward or selecting a later hour.  No chart available for the selected hour. Many charts start at 3 hours ahead, so if you have 0 hours selected try stepping forward or selecting a later hour.


No chart available for the selected hour. Many charts start at 3 hours ahead, so if you have 0 hours selected try stepping forward or selecting a later hour.


The ECM solution still produces a much more amplified jet than the GFS comes up with. 


Unfortunately, the Atlantic then serves up another powerful storm system to our NW for day 10, which prevents the ridge from the SW seen on yesterday's 12z.


GFS still produces a 5-day settled spell for the southeast, shorter as you head NW, thanks to a ridge from the Azores. Then a trough digs down through the UK and brings back the Atlantic regime. Such southward jet motion reflects on the polar vortex continuing to be interfered with. It will be interesting to see whether a short period of stronger polar vortex manages to establish before the stratospheric warming makes itself felt at the lower levels some time next month.


If you have any problems or queries relating to TWO you can Email [email protected]

https://twitter.com/peacockreports 
2023's Homeland Extremes:
T-Max: 30.2°C 9th Sep (...!) | T-Min: -7.1°C 22nd & 23rd Jan | Wettest Day: 25.9mm 2nd Nov | Ice Days: 1 (2nd Dec -1.3°C in freezing fog)
Keep Calm and Forecast On
Stormchaser
14 November 2014 09:58:31

Just for a bit of fun, check out the dramatic turn of events on the GFSP 00z:


No chart available for the selected hour. Many charts start at 3 hours ahead, so if you have 0 hours selected try stepping forward or selecting a later hour.


The run has the most consolidated polar vortex on day 10 after it really bombs out the Atlantic storms (again, giving GEM a run for its money - could it be that GFSP actually overcooks low pressure even more than the old model?), and at face value it doesn't look very promising for a spell of cold, snowy weather in the UK.


...but 6 days later, as the UK high finally gives way:


No chart available for the selected hour. Many charts start at 3 hours ahead, so if you have 0 hours selected try stepping forward or selecting a later hour.


The polar vortex has shifted to Siberia with a small area of residual low heights over Canada, and pressure is on the rise in between - a split vortex, though not a very pronounced one. All of a sudden, the UK is in the firing line for a notable outbreak of cold, snowy conditions from the Arctic.


Just goes to show - a deep, consolidated polar vortex over Greenland can still be displaced by forcing from the stratosphere.


If you have any problems or queries relating to TWO you can Email [email protected]

https://twitter.com/peacockreports 
2023's Homeland Extremes:
T-Max: 30.2°C 9th Sep (...!) | T-Min: -7.1°C 22nd & 23rd Jan | Wettest Day: 25.9mm 2nd Nov | Ice Days: 1 (2nd Dec -1.3°C in freezing fog)
Keep Calm and Forecast On
ITSY
14 November 2014 10:10:39

I should caveat this by saying that cold is not the order of the day for the coming week or two by the looks of things, but one or two interesting features to note for those looking for some.



  1. the GFSP this morning continued yesterday evening's GFSOP theme of raising height towards Greenland at the tail end of the run

  2. this fits in with the stratospheric forecast where warming is not only forecast but, from what I can gather, a minor attack on the upper reaches of the vortex will begin soon, though not enough to cause a SSW at this point

  3. If you look at the final frames of the GEFS midnight update, 4/5 take Europe into the freeze with  height rises to our NE, which can only be a good thing for when we get a continental feed.


I'm no expert but even with all the Atlantic dominated weather at the moment, it is still Autumn with a relatively weak PV and plenty to play for in my view 

Solar Cycles
14 November 2014 10:42:18

Looking at the output this morning suggests  Brian's servers will be collecting a few cobwebs over the coming 14 days. Still we have to get through the filth before we reach nirvana.

Snowfan
14 November 2014 10:46:59

Some signs of interest still brewing, then!


 


Don't forget that, as with most winters, the colder weather is often postponed and pushed back rather than cancelled entirely - the charts might show cold for 2 weeks' time and then suddenly change, for example, but that cold may still be there a few days to a week later on, as could be happening here...


"Let It Snow, Let It Snow, Let It Snow! "
[/size]
idj20
14 November 2014 10:49:16

Mm, both the classic FGS and the new fangled version are still sticking to the idea of high pressure - or at least a ridge - sticking close by the UK over the weekend after this one. Seems that ECM has got out of the wrong side of the bed this morning. 


Folkestone Harbour. 
idj20
14 November 2014 13:23:44

Ta for that lesson, GTW. I think I will be more surer of the outcome come this evening's set of outputs.

(Knowing the models, in the next run ECM then shows a high-pressure orientated set up and it'll be GFS's turn to go nuts with a dartboard low).  


Folkestone Harbour. 
Sevendust
14 November 2014 13:34:16

I suspect one day I'll look at the GFS ensemble suite and see some cold clustering but for now its almost impossible to find any run reaching sub -5'C 850 hPa for London and that has been the case for ages seemingly. The 6z operational becomes a big outlier although it looks outrageously "warm" from mid-range.


Whatever, rather unsettled and relentlessly mild would be my take on the next fortnight although it can change as we know

Solar Cycles
14 November 2014 14:02:13


I suspect one day I'll look at the GFS ensemble suite and see some cold clustering but for now its almost impossible to find any run reaching sub -5'C 850 hPa for London and that has been the case for ages seemingly. The 6z operational becomes a big outlier although it looks outrageously "warm" from mid-range.


Whatever, rather unsettled and relentlessly mild would be my take on the next fortnight although it can change as we know


Originally Posted by: Sevendust 

I don't see any relentless mild in any output, wet yes but temps will fall around to average values as the month goes on.

Gavin P
14 November 2014 14:56:23

Hey guys,


It's Mega JMA Friday - Looking at the next month + Dec to Feb, winter 14/15;



A bit of a shocker at the end!


Rural West Northants 120m asl
Short, medium and long range weather forecast videos @ https://www.youtube.com/user/GavsWeatherVids
Solar Cycles
14 November 2014 16:10:28


Hey guys,


It's Mega JMA Friday - Looking at the next month + Dec to Feb, winter 14/15;



A bit of a shocker at the end!


Originally Posted by: Gavin P 

Well lets hope they are wrong as having to wait until February for anything in the way of cold will be like pulling teeth again.

Sevendust
14 November 2014 16:30:28


I don't see any relentless mild in any output, wet yes but temps will fall around to average values as the month goes on.


Originally Posted by: Solar Cycles 


Probably why its pointless posting in this thread nowadays

sizzle
14 November 2014 16:35:57


Hey guys,


It's Mega JMA Friday - Looking at the next month + Dec to Feb, winter 14/15;



A bit of a shocker at the end!


Originally Posted by: Gavin P 

great vid gav, close to a heart attack at the end there, defo a shocker, i nearly dropped my pint of stella, lol cheers buddy,

Remove ads from site

Ads