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Iceman
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:02:02 PM
Brilliant discussion today by lots of posters! Too much scepticism by some I feel but I don't blame anyone for being sceptical about models predicting easterlies! Many don't come off! This partic easterly has been predicted for Thur/Fri for several days now and the deep cold air has been brought forward to Wed now: this bringing forward of the cold is quite characteristic of easterlies as the models successfully manage to balance the easterly energy from the Atlnatic and the westerly energy on the southern flank of the Scandi high. These models really are amazing applications of IT and we should all respect this despite the flaws!

Two other points I would like to make:

1) Aberdeen GFS ensembles now bullish on -10 C T850s for two to three days Thurs to Sat: similar t850s just before Xmas 2010 albeit a different synoptic pattern resulted in several days of heavy snow in Edinburgh and throughout central Scotland including 7 inches in Glasgow. We shouldn't under-estimate the intensity of Lake-effect snow with T850s of -10 C.

2) The ECM 12Z op is poor relative to the other output: it doesn't bring in as much cold air as UKMO and GFS which perhaps explains why the weekend blows away the cold. A big cold block is hard to shift and even when there are processes to erode the block, it takes time. While I cannot discount ECM, my recollections are that UKMO handles these Scandi-highs the best!

Exciting times I think. The easterly is not looking very dry now but there are disturbances in the easterly flow!
East Kilbride 480 ft
Karl Guille
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:16:56 PM
Colder uppers push back into the UK better at T144.
http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2017020518/gfs-1-144.png?18 
St. Sampson
Guernsey
Gooner
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:19:09 PM


Cold air a tad further across on the 18z.............not that much change from the 12z really


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


doctormog
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:21:44 PM
It's colder than the ECM 12z but the pattern is not massively dissimilar at this point I think. Still lots of twists and turns to come but rather cold at this point.
picturesareme
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:23:30 PM



Cold air a tad further across on the 18z.............not that much change from the 12z really


Originally Posted by: Gooner 


 


not especially that cold unless 4C-6C is 'that cold' for you be fair.. closer to 0C for the south,southwest, and wales!


Fair enough some -8C's in the northeast that might feel cold. I

nsrobins
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:24:56 PM
Very good consistency with the 12Z run to +168. The upper cold pool leaving Denmark on Sunday still there. -9 850s and -3dps will get the job done, but way too soon for specifics.
Neil
Fareham, Hampshire 28m ASL (near estuary)
Stormchaser, Member TORRO
fairweather
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:25:25 PM

UKMO 850s -120

Very cold

Originally Posted by: Steve Murr 

">http://ukmo.3bmeteo.com/mappe/movie/movie.php?dire=UKMWORD_12&base=GH+T850_EUROPA



"* Runs dismissed - GFS / UKMO"


Blimey, I'm struggling to keep up, it changes so fast. 


S.Essex, 42m ASL
Whether Idle
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:26:09 PM

Very good consistency with the 12Z run to +168. The upper cold pool leaving Denmark on Sunday still there. -9 850s and -3dps will get the job done, but way too soon for specifics.

Originally Posted by: nsrobins 


Indeed. Cold air oozing westwards over the UK, epic model watching at the moment.



Dover, 5m asl. Half a mile from the south coast.
Gooner
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:27:05 PM


 


 


not especially that cold unless 4C-6C is 'that cold' for you be fair.. closer to 0C for the south,southwest, and wales!


Fair enough some -8C's in the northeast that might feel cold. I


Originally Posted by: picturesareme 


Its cold don't you worry



will you be ok in this sort of temp, you wont be used to it


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Karl Guille
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:28:57 PM
Atlantic kept well away from the UK on the 18z at T180.
http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2017020518/gfs-0-180.png?18 

Still very cold over the UK but the pool over Scandanavia is not quite so big.
http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2017020518/gfs-1-180.png?18 

A good 18z all things considered.
St. Sampson
Guernsey
Russwirral
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:32:37 PM

That little feature over Denmark has my eyebrows raised


Its little features like this that - as the days draw in, we need to keep an eye out for.  Organised bands of showers off the North Sea are probably our best bet until something more organised from the west occurs.


Netweather GFS Image


 


Netweather GFS Image


Russwirral
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:34:42 PM
Also appears as if this 18z might try and send weather systems over the top of the Scandi High, rather than drill underneath it.

This might work against us, unless it allows the Scandi High to migrate westwards...

we shall see.
White Meadows
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:39:51 PM
warrenb
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:43:57 PM

Houston, we have a problem:

http://old.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn1921.gif

Originally Posted by: White Meadows 


I see no problem there. Good sign for retrogression 


tallyho_83
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:45:10 PM

Quite a block 1050mb!?? - Will be hard to shift but will it sink or what?


It needs to build further north & thank goodness there isn't many intense Atlantic storms.



Home Location - Kellands Lane, Okehampton, Devon (200m ASL)
---------------------------------------
Sean Moon
Magical Moon
www.magical-moon.com


David M Porter
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:48:33 PM

Houston, we have a problem:

http://old.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn1921.gif

Originally Posted by: White Meadows 


Doesn't look that bad to me!


Lenzie, Glasgow

"Let us not take ourselves too seriously. None of us has a monopoly on wisdom, and we must always be ready to listen and respect other points of view."- Queen Elizabeth II 1926-2022
tallyho_83
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:49:42 PM

Baltic HP - how about that!?

http://old.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn2521.gif




Originally Posted by: tallyho_83 



Home Location - Kellands Lane, Okehampton, Devon (200m ASL)
---------------------------------------
Sean Moon
Magical Moon
www.magical-moon.com


tallyho_83
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:52:52 PM


So at +288 - Pete Tong it goes...as someone else on here ha said!?


Home Location - Kellands Lane, Okehampton, Devon (200m ASL)
---------------------------------------
Sean Moon
Magical Moon
www.magical-moon.com


picturesareme
Sunday, February 5, 2017 10:56:35 PM


 


Its cold don't you worry



will you be ok in this sort of temp, you wont be used to it


Originally Posted by: Gooner 


a tad better 

Phil G
Sunday, February 5, 2017 11:19:14 PM



So at +288 - Pete Tong it goes...as someone else on here ha said!?


Originally Posted by: tallyho_83 

288!, in FI!, that's an eternity in most cases. Can be T12 sometimes. Charts will change umpteen times before then. Think someone earlier called you out for taking an  FI chart as gospel.

Russwirral
Sunday, February 5, 2017 11:23:40 PM


Quite a block 1050mb!?? - Will be hard to shift but will it sink or what?


It needs to build further north & thank goodness there isn't many intense Atlantic storms.



Originally Posted by: tallyho_83 


 


One things for sure... for a winter chart theres a hell of alot of high pressure in that chart. 


Gandalf The White
Sunday, February 5, 2017 11:24:12 PM


 


So at +288 - Pete Tong it goes...as someone else on here ha said!?


Originally Posted by: tallyho_83 


Firstly it's 12 DAYS away, Tally. We all know it won't look like that in 12 hours never mind 12 days.


Secondly, I don't see too much wrong with that chart. There's a reload from the north and it's still cold.


Location: South Cambridgeshire
130 metres ASL
52.0N 0.1E


Quantum
Monday, February 6, 2017 12:46:26 AM

Quite cold days predicted by the GFS.



Twitter: @QuantumOverlord (general), @MedicaneWatch (medicane/TC stuff)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)

Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling.

2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)

Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.

2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp):

26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
Karl Guille
Monday, February 6, 2017 5:30:24 AM
Excellent looking UKMO with a nice easterly feed between 72 and 144.
http://www.meteociel.fr/ukmo/runs/2017020600/UW96-21.GIF?06-06 
http://www.meteociel.fr/ukmo/runs/2017020600/UW144-21.GIF?06-06 
St. Sampson
Guernsey
Karl Guille
Monday, February 6, 2017 5:44:26 AM
GEM broadly similar to UKMO at 144 but with a distorted feed from the east and by 192 the Atlantic begins to push in!
http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gem/runs/2017020600/gem-0-144.png?00 
http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gem/runs/2017020600/gem-0-192.png?00 

GFS maintains the cleanest ESE feed and the reward is a secondary feed of cold uppers keeping things decidedly chilly right into FI!
http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2017020600/gfs-0-144.png?0 
http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2017020600/gfs-0-192.png?0 
http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2017020600/gfs-0-240.png?0 
http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2017020600/gfs-1-240.png?0 

The only slight disappointment is that the Op (and Control) are not widely supported on the short ensembles!
http://modeles7.meteociel.fr/modeles/gens/graphe_ens3.php?x=308&ext=1&y=132&run=0&runpara=0 
St. Sampson
Guernsey
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