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Brian Gaze
20 January 2016 12:18:57

Something cooking possibly:



Brian Gaze
Berkhamsted
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tallyho_83
20 January 2016 12:26:15

Is it me or does this look like colder air could come in from the east end of Next week? as the Weather for the week ahead suggests it's a possibility? Bet we will be back to a Bartlett in the 12z run.

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn2041.gif



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Ally Pally Snowman
20 January 2016 13:41:11

Lovely GFS this morning and we know that the GFS is the best model for picking up pattern changes from far out. So in GFS we trust.


 


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kmoorman
20 January 2016 14:08:31


Lovely GFS this morning and we know that the GFS is the best model for picking up pattern changes from far out. So in GFS we trust.


Originally Posted by: Ally Pally Snowman 


I hope so, but the ensemble view shows that the colder option is still in the minority.  It would be lovely is subsequent runs and other output were to support this with an increasing likelihood, and then we'd be off on another of our rollercoaster rides in Model Watching World.


Maybe, just maybe.


 


 


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Stormchaser
20 January 2016 14:13:47
The natural order of models has been disrupted, with GFS seeing a more effective split jet than the others.

Obviously ECM missed the potential until late with last weekend's event but UKMO got it well in advance. It seems there is a rule that one model must spot it ahead of the rest but not always the same model!

Okay so I'm being a bit tongue in cheek here as the split is not by any means guaranteed to set the stage for the block to our E/NE to extend west an link with our local high... But it seems a reasonable idea and one Fergie ha kept mentioning in recent times even when it was a cry small minority outcome yesterday. Interesting, that, as was Shaf's mention in the BBC outlook the other day.
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JACKO4EVER
20 January 2016 14:25:27
So much has to fall in to place even without shortwave or hurricane 😄 Interference- it's a long shot- but I find GFS is excellent at picking up pattern changes in the 10 to 14 day period. Who knows? But this could be a last shot at real cold this winter, the clock is ticking and the sun is feeling warmer in today's beautiful sunshine
Shropshire
20 January 2016 14:31:36

The ensembles (Met O and ECM) show more support for a NW or N type in 10 days time or so, much less for any easterly or building high from the East

Originally Posted by: TomC 


 


Thanks Tom. seems a bit strange as it's hard to see how we could get a N/NW flow from the general position shown at day 7.


 


 


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kmoorman
20 January 2016 14:34:38


 


Thanks Tom. seems a bit strange as it's hard to see how we could get a N/NW flow from the general position shown at day 7.


 


Originally Posted by: Shropshire 


It could only be from retrogression to West of the UK, surely?


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warrenb
20 January 2016 14:35:42
Which after the easterly a fair few GEFS do.
TomC
  • TomC
  • Advanced Member
20 January 2016 14:49:22


 


It could only be from retrogression to West of the UK, surely?


Originally Posted by: kmoorman 


 


The European high collapses ahead of a cold front and depression then a new one builds further west

kmoorman
20 January 2016 14:59:32


 


The European high collapses ahead of a cold front and depression then a new one builds further west


Originally Posted by: TomC 


Ah ok, a reset rather than a retrogression.   thanks.


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Saint Snow
20 January 2016 15:25:29

 


The European high collapses ahead of a cold front and depression then a new one builds further west


Originally Posted by: TomC 


 


I could live with that



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Stormchaser
20 January 2016 15:26:02

We are in a period in which momentum is being added over the space of a week or so, and the models have a terrible habit of overdoing the amount of momentum added. I have seen evidence this morning (GWO plots for those in the know) to suggest this is happening again and is likely to continue for at least a few more days.


Given that split jet scenarios require a weak enough jet for a low to drop SE and support highs at latitudes that can bring the UK easterlies, this could have big ramifications for later next week.


I've not been sure, though, whether it will be enough to overcome the state of the Arctic in the run-up to the anticipated large warming or SSW (which it will be has not yet become clear). The uncertainty remains today but that the GFS model is managing to produce some slider low scenarios does suggest to me that the odds of it being enough are greater than I had been reckoning.


The next 3-5 days might be fun, or hear-tearing, or most likely a bit of both 


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warrenb
20 January 2016 15:28:31
And we are off, and at 6hrs the 1020 isobar is 4 mm lower over Scotland.
molly40
20 January 2016 15:50:15


We are in a period in which momentum is being added over the space of a week or so, and the models have a terrible habit of overdoing the amount of momentum added. I have seen evidence this morning (GWO plots for those in the know) to suggest this is happening again and is likely to continue for at least a few more days.


Given that split jet scenarios require a weak enough jet for a low to drop SE and support highs at latitudes that can bring the UK easterlies, this could have big ramifications for later next week.


I've not been sure, though, whether it will be enough to overcome the state of the Arctic in the run-up to the anticipated large warming or SSW (which it will be has not yet become clear). The uncertainty remains today but that the GFS model is managing to produce some slider low scenarios does suggest to me that the odds of it being enough are greater than I had been reckoning.


The next 3-5 days might be fun, or hear-tearing, or most likely a bit of both 


Originally Posted by: Stormchaser 


 


why is the easterly so difficult to achieve,i mean a mega-cold one,like in the old days lol,it gets close sometimes,but nearly always misses ,in the old days ,you would see the blues advancing from russia and nearly always they would make it across the Norh Sea to the UK,now its the other way around,it was so exciting seeing the march of cold air travelling to the uk and knowing snow would be falling soon

JACKO4EVER
20 January 2016 16:10:19


 


 


why is the easterly so difficult to achieve,i mean a mega-cold one,like in the old days lol,it gets close sometimes,but nearly always misses ,in the old days ,you would see the blues advancing from russia and nearly always they would make it across the Norh Sea to the UK,now its the other way around,it was so exciting seeing the march of cold air travelling to the uk and knowing snow would be falling soon


Originally Posted by: molly40 


molly I have often thought of this myself. Back in the 70's and 80's Siberian winds came every so often accompanied by beefy snow showers for my area. This scenario would often last 7 to 14 days, the high eventually being pushed back by Atlantic winds that more often than not brought transitory snow. Why does it not happen now- well I haven't a clue- but it has puzzled me for some time. Perhaps some of our more knowledgeable posters know the  finer details for such events- or non events as we have become accustomed to?

Sinky1970
20 January 2016 16:24:08

Looks like this morning's run has been slung out the window, 12c next Wednesday evening if that chart comes off, no major surprises.

soperman
20 January 2016 16:26:33

Instead of the Scandi block, Mike gets a snowstorm
The Beast from the East
20 January 2016 17:00:56

Oh dear, GFS and GEM now pants.


I think it may be worth taking a break for a week or so.


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Nordic Snowman
20 January 2016 17:05:02

The ensembles (Met O and ECM) show more support for a NW or N type in 10 days time or so, much less for any easterly or building high from the East

Originally Posted by: TomC 


My exact thoughts too


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Zubzero
20 January 2016 17:07:10


Oh dear, GFS and GEM now pants.


I think it may be worth taking a break for a week or so.


Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


As is the meto run 


Strat warming will save us http://modeles.meteociel.fr/modeles/gfs/runs/2016012012/gfsnh-10-336.png?12


 

Nordic Snowman
20 January 2016 17:12:26

Instead of the Scandi block, Mike gets a snowstorm

Originally Posted by: soperman 


 Haven't looked at the charts yet but I am now in a state of anticipation. Hope you're right


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SJV
20 January 2016 17:31:32


Something cooking possibly:



Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 


Certainly looks that way. Shame GFS has been less than reliable during this month. Either way it's good to see an FI trending to cold with each run 

SJV
20 January 2016 17:32:33


Looks like this morning's run has been slung out the window, 12c next Wednesday evening if that chart comes off, no major surprises.


Originally Posted by: Sinky1970 


Well the OP was one of the colder solutions this morning. Expect the 12z op to be within the milder range this time. Oh the joys of model watching! 

LA2B MeridFlowEuro09
20 January 2016 17:41:06

 


The Warm Sectors and Sceuro high Western Europe, should return very soon indeed.


Far North and Far NNE Atlantic and Far NW Atlantic Polar Vortex Low's are expected.


Often mild in 546 dam line SSW flows, and often dry outlook for Model Output discussion, for next 7-9 days.


At least we will not get much rain from this, and less windy weather is offered.


 


Great.


😀😆.


Climate is warming up, Scotland and N Ireland and North England still often gets some Winter frost, ice and snow, November to March, but the SE and South UK including S Central England and Wales, together with the West and North through the year, they sometimes get more rain than London and S SE England, where some longer dry fine spells without much heavy rain is seen every year.

The North Atlantic Sea often gets some much Colder Wintry conditions from November to March Months, and Mild SW and South winds tend to be more frequent over the East and SE of North Atlantic Sea, as the Azores High tends to stay in charge. 

With this warmth and heat, the Central and South UK has become mostly free of snow and frost.

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