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Retron
13 May 2015 17:22:56


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/nigel-farage/11602620/Police-probe-allegation-of-electoral-fraud-in-Thanet-South.html


Perhaps Nige didnt lose after all. A lot of people were surprised at the size of the Tory win


Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


And perhaps he did after all!


Police say no evidence of electoral fraud


Police investigating allegations of election fraud at the all-important South Thanet count say there is no evidence of electoral fraud.


http://www.kentonline.co.uk/thanet/news/police-probe-election-fraud-allegations-36864/


 


 


Leysdown, north Kent
Saint Snow
13 May 2015 18:47:30

So Mark Carney today basically validates Milliband's message about most jobs created being part-time/low-skilled/McJobs, and downgrades growth forecasts.


 


Hopefully Varoufakis will, after a shrug & a mischievous grin, press the red button to call the Krauts' bluff.



Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
Saint Snow
13 May 2015 19:48:44

New allegations that the Tory Party forced the BBC to take a pro-Tory stance during the election run-up. admittedly they're made by Tom Baldwin from the Milliband camp - but the fact he's gone public speaks volumes.


BBC executives and journalists have told me that there were regular, repeated threats from senior Tories during this election campaign about ‘what would happen afterwards’ if they did not fall into line.


It is a disturbing suggestion that a democratically elected government would seek to stamp on and silence dissent from an independent broadcaster.


There has been a long-standing campaign by the Conservative party, fueled by the commercial interests of sections of the press, to attack the world’s most successful state-funded public service broadcaster as a giant leftwing conspiracy”



Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
Brian Gaze
13 May 2015 20:32:53


New allegations that the Tory Party forced the BBC to take a pro-Tory stance during the election run-up. admittedly they're made by Tom Baldwin from the Milliband camp - but the fact he's gone public speaks volumes.


 


Originally Posted by: Saint Snow 


There have been suggestions of smashing up the Beeb web site to facilitate the paywall market in the UK. Personally I'm not convinced this would be achieved as more people would just end up in the walled garden looking for their news.


Brian Gaze
Berkhamsted
TWO Buzz - get the latest news and views 
"I'm not socialist, I know that. I don't believe in sharing my money." - Gary Numan
KevBrads1
14 May 2015 08:11:22

They were a great double act the two Eds for political farce, one loses an election and the other loses his seat.


UserPostedImage


MANCHESTER SUMMER INDEX for 2021: 238
Timelapses, old weather forecasts and natural phenomena videos can be seen on this site
http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCgrSD1BwFz2feWDTydhpEhQ/playlists
Maunder Minimum
14 May 2015 08:43:27
Interesting piece by Dan Hodges - he claims a shadow minister resigned at 2pm on election day, because he was disgusted with the campaign and what a Miliband Government would mean :
http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/9528312/inside-the-milibunker-the-last-days-of-ed-did-ed-miliband-sacrifice-ed-balls/ 

I wonder who it was?

New world order coming.
Justin W
14 May 2015 09:53:27

I didn't detect any bias in BBC election coverage. We get this every time there is an election and, quite frankly, it's tiresome and pathetic whinging from the the usual political suspects.


Yo yo yo. 148-3 to the 3 to the 6 to the 9, representing the ABQ, what up, biatch?
The Beast from the East
14 May 2015 10:42:52

It was a disgrace that all the broadcasters caved into Cameron's wishes on the TV debates. They should have "empty chaired" him. Instead we were given huge exposure to Sturgeon and the Welsh woman and the mad Aussie, all of which helped the Tories.


Also, during the BBC Question the Leaders debate, a Tory ativist, Catherine Shuttleworth (one of the signatures of the dodgy letter), was allowed to pass herself off as an undecided voter, and given a chance to question Ed. She was later seen high fiving Gideon in the Spin room


 


"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
turbotubbs
14 May 2015 11:51:56

I cannot take anything Tom Watson says seriously - this quote from the article is enough 'Since the election, we have already learned that the Tories plan to gerrymander parliamentary constituencies in their favour and remove voting rights from Scottish MPs.'


He should look up what Gerrymander actually means.


 


From Wikipedia "In the process of setting electoral districts, gerrymandering is a practice that attempts to establish a political advantage for a particular party or group by manipulating district boundaries to create partisan advantaged districts. "


 


In this country the independent electoral commission determines boundaries, not the government. IN the last parliament the honest, democratic, decent etc etc Lib Dems combined with labour to block reform, included in which were measures to reduce the number of constituencies (save money for the country) and equalise the numbers of voters in each.


It is a disgrace that voters on the Isle of Wight say have a vote that is worth only 0.196 that of a vote in Na h-Eileanan An Iar (110,924 registered to vote versus 21,837). It will never be possible to have exactly even boundaries, but we could at least try.

KevBrads1
14 May 2015 12:10:33


It was a disgrace that all the broadcasters caved into Cameron's wishes on the TV debates. They should have "empty chaired" him. Instead we were given huge exposure to Sturgeon and the Welsh woman and the mad Aussie, all of which helped the Tories.


Also, during the BBC Question the Leaders debate, a Tory ativist, Catherine Shuttleworth (one of the signatures of the dodgy letter), was allowed to pass herself off as an undecided voter, and given a chance to question Ed. She was later seen high fiving Gideon in the Spin room


 


Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


Sturgeon got huge exposure in the leaders debate when Cameron was present if you remember. 


And Cameron was in effect emptied chaired at the next debate, as it was the same people again except Cameron and Clegg.  


As for the undecided voter, I don't know about this but wasn't the audience made up of 25% Tory, 25% Labour etc?


Beast, you need wake up son, Ed Miliband was not a credible alternative to the bulk of the populace and hasn't been for a long time. It comes to something when Cameron was ahead of Miliband in Scotland.


MANCHESTER SUMMER INDEX for 2021: 238
Timelapses, old weather forecasts and natural phenomena videos can be seen on this site
http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCgrSD1BwFz2feWDTydhpEhQ/playlists
Brian Gaze
14 May 2015 12:19:16


Beast, you need wake up son, Ed Miliband was not a credible alternative to the bulk of the populace and hasn't been for a long time. It comes to something when Cameron was ahead of Miliband in Scotland.


Originally Posted by: KevBrads1 


 Agree. Perhaps Labour should go into the next election offering the working classes free subscriptions to Sky and free tabs (although Priti Patel may be on the case already)


Brian Gaze
Berkhamsted
TWO Buzz - get the latest news and views 
"I'm not socialist, I know that. I don't believe in sharing my money." - Gary Numan
Saint Snow
14 May 2015 12:31:52


I didn't detect any bias in BBC election coverage. We get this every time there is an election and, quite frankly, it's tiresome and pathetic whinging from the the usual political suspects.


Originally Posted by: Justin W 


 


FTR, I don't believe there is a bias from the BBC; I've said this several times in the past.


However, if there's an allegation made in public that one political party - the incumbent governing party no less - has been using threats to the state broadcaster in order to set the news agenda in their favour, then surely we should look to see whether there's any evidence to back this up. As I posted, the topics related to the election covered by the news haven't followed the usual pattern, with issues like the NHS, where Labour are strong, being kept out of the spotlight.


In addition, the Tories and the right in general have for years been increasingly vocal in their unsubstantiated claims that the BBC Kean leftwards. Then we have the fact that certain other media empires openly despise the BBC arrangement and have persistently lobbied the Tory party, where News Corporation especially have some prominent allies, to rip up the impartial existing arrangement 


Of course, this is circumstantial at best and proves absolutely nothing.


However, as I'm sure we all agree, if the government - any coloured government - was using threats to the state broadcaster in order to try to allow them to set the news agenda, this is dangerous - and more akin to regimes in certain other countries that we on here frequently denigrate



Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
Maunder Minimum
14 May 2015 17:40:49


I cannot take anything Tom Watson says seriously - this quote from the article is enough 'Since the election, we have already learned that the Tories plan to gerrymander parliamentary constituencies in their favour and remove voting rights from Scottish MPs.'


He should look up what Gerrymander actually means.


 


From Wikipedia "In the process of setting electoral districts, gerrymandering is a practice that attempts to establish a political advantage for a particular party or group by manipulating district boundaries to create partisan advantaged districts. "


 


In this country the independent electoral commission determines boundaries, not the government. IN the last parliament the honest, democratic, decent etc etc Lib Dems combined with labour to block reform, included in which were measures to reduce the number of constituencies (save money for the country) and equalise the numbers of voters in each.


It is a disgrace that voters on the Isle of Wight say have a vote that is worth only 0.196 that of a vote in Na h-Eileanan An Iar (110,924 registered to vote versus 21,837). It will never be possible to have exactly even boundaries, but we could at least try.


Originally Posted by: turbotubbs 


Yes. In response to the Labourites all you have to point out is that Blair achieved a large majority with 36% of the vote, whilst Cameron gets a tiny majority with 37%, yet they still complain they was robbed!


 


New world order coming.
The Beast from the East
14 May 2015 19:39:48
Pollsters now saying Labour will need PR to get back into power when the boundary changes go through. Jockland is gone and will probably break away soon anyway so forget about that. The liberals are dead and so are UKip so we are back to 2 party system. Labour has to become like the US Democrats to compete. Basically soft Tories. Not ideal, but the only way to win power
"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
Devonian
14 May 2015 19:51:15

Pollsters now saying Labour will need PR to get back into power when the boundary changes go through. Jockland is gone and will probably break away soon anyway so forget about that. The liberals are dead and so are UKip so we are back to 2 party system. Labour has to become like the US Democrats to compete. Basically soft Tories. Not ideal, but the only way to win power

Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


Possible.


Otoh, maybe we've seen high water for the anti Europe lot - I suspect Ukip are there, in fact they're probably they'll not so much be sunk as on the way to the political Marianas Trench by 2020. Scotland? Again, I'm not sure the SNP are going to go for independence within the five years to 2020. LibD? They've been 'dead' before - there is a liberal element to this country, be it divided or not.


Besides, it's a truism that a week, let alone five years, is a long time in politics. If I'm wrong about the above, if by 2020 we're two states but only one in the EU then politics WILL change even in England as well. Remember, the people didn't cheer Cameron back into Downing Street, they shrugged, sighed and put him back.

Saint Snow
14 May 2015 19:59:27

Pollsters now saying Labour will need PR to get back into power when the boundary changes go through. Jockland is gone and will probably break away soon anyway so forget about that. The liberals are dead and so are UKip so we are back to 2 party system. Labour has to become like the US Democrats to compete. Basically soft Tories. Not ideal, but the only way to win power

Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


 


I disagree. British people don't want the same party in power ad nauseum. Given our problems & the British psyche, no government can provide a solution to all our ills - whether right OR left.


We may have to bear 2/3 Tory governments, but then they'll be voted out, regardless of who the opposition is.


 


IMO, Labour could regain popularity by being economically left-leaning & pro-workers' rights (if they provide the correct narrative), whilst becoming hardline on things like immigration, the EU, etc.


 



Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
Saint Snow
14 May 2015 20:02:20

 


Possible.


Otoh, maybe we've seen high water for the anti Europe lot - I suspect Ukip are there, in fact they're probably they'll not so much be sunk as on the way to the political Marianas Trench by 2020. Scotland? Again, I'm not sure the SNP are going to go for independence within the five years to 2020. LibD? They've been 'dead' before - there is a liberal element to this country, be it divided or not.


Besides, it's a truism that a week, let alone five years, is a long time in politics. If I'm wrong about the above, if by 2020 we're two states but only one in the EU then politics WILL change even in England as well. Remember, the people didn't cheer Cameron back into Downing Street, they shrugged, sighed and put him back.


Originally Posted by: Devonian 


 


I'm not sure the Scots would vote for independence.


If the SNP believe their surge in electoral popularity is purely down to increasing nationalism, then they're wrong. I think that Scottish people concluded that the SNP are the best option to look after Scottish interests in the UK (and, of course, they have some leftist policy, as opposed to Labour's pitiful 'left-lite' gimmicks)



Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
Brian Gaze
14 May 2015 20:46:37

Pollsters now saying Labour will need PR to get back into power when the boundary changes go through. Jockland is gone and will probably break away soon anyway so forget about that. The liberals are dead and so are UKip so we are back to 2 party system. Labour has to become like the US Democrats to compete. Basically soft Tories. Not ideal, but the only way to win power

Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


Until last week the same experts were saying the Tories could never win a majority again. They do come out with a lot of codswallop to justify their salaries and fill the press. Sorry, but when you get to my age you've heard it all before and see it for the rot it is. 


Brian Gaze
Berkhamsted
TWO Buzz - get the latest news and views 
"I'm not socialist, I know that. I don't believe in sharing my money." - Gary Numan
Maunder Minimum
14 May 2015 21:45:17

Pollsters now saying Labour will need PR to get back into power when the boundary changes go through. Jockland is gone and will probably break away soon anyway so forget about that. The liberals are dead and so are UKip so we are back to 2 party system. Labour has to become like the US Democrats to compete. Basically soft Tories. Not ideal, but the only way to win power

Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


Yea right! The same people who predicted a dead-heat in the election.


Face it Beast, you simply had a rubbish leader with a rubbish message - that is what needs sorting out.


New world order coming.
Justin W
14 May 2015 21:49:30

It may well have been posted before but this made me p*ss my pants:



Another Labour insider told of the scene in the press office when Miliband posed with the notorious Ed stone, the 8ft 6in slab of limestone upon which his six key election pledges were inscribed. When it appeared on TV, a press officer ‘started screaming. He stood in the office, just screaming over and over again at the screen. It was so bad they thought he was having a breakdown.’


 



Yo yo yo. 148-3 to the 3 to the 6 to the 9, representing the ABQ, what up, biatch?
SEMerc
14 May 2015 22:19:47


 


Yea right! The same people who predicted a dead-heat in the election.


Face it Beast, you simply had a rubbish leader with a rubbish message - that is what needs sorting out.


Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum 


I've largely kept my counsel in this thread today, principally due to the higher than usual amount of bollocks written i.e. Limp Dumbs finished, UKIP finished.....blah blah blah.


It is the Labour Party that's in the most immediate trouble. Longer term the Party will be hoping the Limp Dumbs are dead and UKIP are indeed dead.  Good luck with that.


Yet as as was said on QT earlier, it's going to be a long hard slog ahead for Labour - not only attracting back Scottish voters that have gone over to Wee Jimmy Krankie, as well as those working class voters in the North whom Labour seemingly no longer speaks to.


And then of course Labour is going to have to make inroads down south by putting out a message in tune with more prosperous voters.


This will require a high wire act The Flying Wallendas would be proud of.

The Beast from the East
14 May 2015 23:12:28


It may well have been posted before but this made me p*ss my pants:



Another Labour insider told of the scene in the press office when Miliband posed with the notorious Ed stone, the 8ft 6in slab of limestone upon which his six key election pledges were inscribed. When it appeared on TV, a press officer ‘started screaming. He stood in the office, just screaming over and over again at the screen. It was so bad they thought he was having a breakdown.’


 



Originally Posted by: Justin W 


Like the scene from "The Thick of It", when the Tory adviser goes mental after an embarrassing picture of him goes viral


 


"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
Brian Gaze
15 May 2015 07:44:36

SNP planning insurrection in Scotland:


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3082449/SNP-plot-unofficial-second-referendum-Plan-hold-vote-without-PM-s-approval-Cameron-Sturgeon-meet-talks-today.html


My view
Should something like this go ahead the outcome could be disastrous. An unofficial 'yes' vote which wasn't accepted by Westminster would probably lead to British troops being deployed on the streets of Scotland. God help us.


Brian Gaze
Berkhamsted
TWO Buzz - get the latest news and views 
"I'm not socialist, I know that. I don't believe in sharing my money." - Gary Numan
Maunder Minimum
15 May 2015 07:57:59


SNP planning insurrection in Scotland:


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3082449/SNP-plot-unofficial-second-referendum-Plan-hold-vote-without-PM-s-approval-Cameron-Sturgeon-meet-talks-today.html


My view
Should something like this go ahead the outcome could be disastrous. An unofficial 'yes' vote which wasn't accepted by Westminster would probably lead to British troops being deployed on the streets of Scotland. God help us.


Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 


Question?  Scotland will get devo-max - why would they then want disunion on top of that? 


If they want to exchange democratic rule from Holyrood and Westminster, for dictat from Berlin and Brussels, then more fool them! 


 


New world order coming.
SEMerc
15 May 2015 08:05:33


SNP planning insurrection in Scotland:


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3082449/SNP-plot-unofficial-second-referendum-Plan-hold-vote-without-PM-s-approval-Cameron-Sturgeon-meet-talks-today.html


My view
Should something like this go ahead the outcome could be disastrous. An unofficial 'yes' vote which wasn't accepted by Westminster would probably lead to British troops being deployed on the streets of Scotland. God help us.


Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 


Sadly, Dave won't make a sufficient pig's ear of the 're-negotiations' for Brexit to occur, thereby lessening the chances of Wee Jimmy Krankie leading the Picts out of the Union, which in turn will mean England continuing to be bled dry politically and economically.

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