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xioni2
18 March 2020 23:31:44

Something has gone seriously wrong in the UK approach to this and things will now gradually deteriorate. 

xioni2
18 March 2020 23:34:24

The jump of deaths in Italy today is a blow to hopes the severe restrictions were working after a levelling off last three days.
Hopefully it won’t be repeated or the 25K modelled for Italy looks depressingly realistic.

Originally Posted by: nsrobins 


Actually the Italians were a bit more optimistic today because of fewer ICU admissions and smaller increase in the number of infections. 

Saint Snow
18 March 2020 23:35:56


 Whether that will happen or we will continue to make the same mistakes once this is over remains to be seen. 


Originally Posted by: Rob K 


 


I know which way my money would be on.



Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
Chunky Pea
18 March 2020 23:36:21


 


My mum died last week and it looks as though my wife and I will only be able to attend the funeral "remotely". My dad died on Boxing Day so  both of my parents have gone within the space of a few months. They were 92 and 89 so both had quite long lives. A big part of me thinks they both got out at just the right time. It really feels as though the world has been turned on its head in the last 6 months. 


Originally Posted by: Brian Gaze 


Just awful. My sincere condolences. 


Current Conditions
https://t.ly/MEYqg 


"You don't have to know anything to have an opinion"
--Roger P, 12/Oct/2022
Saint Snow
18 March 2020 23:51:30


 


Actually the Italians were a bit more optimistic today because of fewer ICU admissions and smaller increase in the number of infections. 


Originally Posted by: xioni2 


 


And that's the key. Deaths now are the result of infections 14-28 days ago. If we continue to see deaths increase a week, two weeks from now, then the measures put in place in the past fortnight have failed. They plateau at this level for the next couple of weeks and they've arrested the spread. But it's a consistent decrease that will show a success.


I'm hoping the antibody test becomes widely available here shortly, as that will give us a more accurate picture of infection rates and mortality. And without wanting to jump on a bandwagon, I have a slight suspicion (probably borne out of hope) that me and the family have actually had it.


 



Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
JHutch
18 March 2020 23:55:42

Parts of the tube are shutting down. 40 stations closed from tomorrow morning, Waterloo and City line closed from Friday. No night tube this weekend.


 


https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-london-shops-could-close-and-transport-restricted-by-weekend-whitehall-sources-11959814


 

xioni2
19 March 2020 00:11:49


  And that's the key. Deaths now are the result of infections 14-28 days ago. If we continue to see deaths increase a week, two weeks from now, then the measures put in place in the past fortnight have failed. They plateau at this level for the next couple of weeks and they've arrested the spread. But it's a consistent decrease that will show a success.


Originally Posted by: Saint Snow 


Spot on.


 

xioni2
19 March 2020 00:18:35


 One of my mountain biking friends is in Madeira at the moment. I certainly wouldn’t have gone but she seems to be perfectly happy. 


Originally Posted by: Rob K 


I'd prefer being out of the UK for the next month or so.

xioni2
19 March 2020 00:19:38

From the Editor of the Lancet on the failed UK approach:


On 24 January, Chinese doctors and scientists reported the first description of a new disease caused by a novel coronavirus. They described how a strange series of cases of pneumonia had presented in December in Wuhan, a city of 11 million people and the capital of Hubei province. At that time, 800 cases of the new disease had been confirmed. The virus had already been exported to Thailand, Japan and South Korea.


Most of the 41 people described in this first report, published in the Lancet, presented with non-specific symptoms of fever and cough. More than half had difficulties in breathing. But most worryingly of all, a third of these patients had such a severe illness that they had to be admitted to an intensive care unit. Most developed a critical complication of their viral pneumonia – acute respiratory distress syndrome. Half died.


The Chinese scientists pulled no punches. “The number of deaths is rising quickly,” they wrote. The provision of personal protective equipment for health workers was strongly recommended. Testing for the virus should be done immediately a diagnosis was suspected. They concluded that the mortality rate was high. And they urged careful surveillance of this new virus in view of its “pandemic potential”.


That was in January. Why did it take the UK government eight weeks to recognise the seriousness of what we now call Covid-19?


In 2003, Chinese officials were heavily criticised for keeping the dangers of a new viral disease, severe acute respiratory syndrome (Sars), secret. By 2020, a new generation of Chinese scientists had learned their lesson. Under immense pressure, as the epidemic exploded around them, they took time to write up their findings in a foreign language and seek publication in a medical journal thousands of miles away. Their rapid and rigorous work was an urgent warning to the world. We owe those scientists enormous thanks.


But medical and scientific advisers to the UK government ignored their warnings. For unknown reasons they waited. And watched.


The scientists advising ministers seemed to believe that this new virus could be treated much like influenza. Graham Medley, one of the government’s expert scientific advisers, was disarmingly explicit. In an interview on Newsnight last week, he explained the UK’s approach: to allow a controlled epidemic of large numbers of people, which would generate “herd immunity”. Our scientists recommended “a situation where the majority of the population are immune to the infection. And the only way of developing that, in the absence of a vaccine, is for the majority of the population to become infected.”


Medley suggested that, “ideally”, we might need “a nice big epidemic” among the less vulnerable. “What we are going to have to try and do,” he said, was to “manage this acquisition of herd immunity and minimise the exposure of people who are vulnerable.” Sir Patrick Vallance, the government’s chief scientific adviser, suggested that the target was to infect 60% of the UK’s population.


Something has gone badly wrong in the way the UK has handled Covid-19. I know Chris Whitty, the chief medical officer, and Patrick Vallance. I have the utmost respect for both. They have had the services of some of the most talented researchers in the world to draw on. But somehow there was a collective failure among politicians and perhaps even government experts to recognise the signals that Chinese and Italian scientists were sending. We had the opportunity and the time to learn from the experience of other countries. For reasons that are not entirely clear, the UK missed those signals. We missed those opportunities.


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/18/coronavirus-uk-expert-advice-wrong


 

The Beast from the East
19 March 2020 00:34:43


From the Editor of the Lancet on the failed UK approach:


 


Something has gone badly wrong in the way the UK has handled Covid-19. I know Chris Whitty, the chief medical officer, and Patrick Vallance. I have the utmost respect for both.


 


Originally Posted by: xioni2 


I wish he would just say it out loud. These two clowns have totally arsed up, though perhaps they were following orders from Rasputin


Purley, Surrey, 70m ASL

"We have some alternative facts for you"

Kelly-Ann Conway - former special adviser to the President
The Beast from the East
19 March 2020 00:37:04


 


You really are a contemptible tw4t.


Originally Posted by: Justin W 



If pubs are open, do you seriously expect plebs not to use them?  Blame Boris, not the punters


Purley, Surrey, 70m ASL

"We have some alternative facts for you"

Kelly-Ann Conway - former special adviser to the President
xioni2
19 March 2020 00:41:39

Britain faces a “massive shortage” of ventilators that will be needed to treat critically ill patients suffering from coronavirus, after it failed to invest enough in intensive care equipment, a leading ventilator manufacturer said on Wednesday.


“England is very poorly equipped,” said Andreas Wieland, chief executive of Hamilton Medical in Switzerland, which says it is the world’s largest ventilator maker.


“They’re going to have a massive shortage, once the virus really arrives there,” he told Reuters in an interview.


Ventilators, running in the thousands of dollars per unit, are used to help people with respiratory difficulties to breathe. They are high-tech versions of the “iron lungs” that kept people alive into the 1950s during fierce polio epidemics.


“They are not well equipped with ventilators and intensive care stations,” he said. “They invested very little, and I think now they will pay the price.”


Hamilton CEO Wieland is skeptical, however, of the British government’s recent call for manufacturers from other industries including Ford (F.N), Honda (7267.T) and Rolls Royce (RR.L) to help make equipment including ventilators.


“I wish them the best of luck,” Wieland said. “I do not believe anything will come of it. These devices are very complex. It takes us four to five years” to develop a new product.


https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-ventilators-exclus/exclusive-uk-faces-massive-shortage-of-ventilators-swiss-manufacturer-idUKKBN2153GU

The Beast from the East
19 March 2020 00:43:00


Purley, Surrey, 70m ASL

"We have some alternative facts for you"

Kelly-Ann Conway - former special adviser to the President
Saint Snow
19 March 2020 00:55:20




Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


 


He may be a rat-faced, Scouse-hating Manc, but he's otherwise a good person.



Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
SOakley
19 March 2020 01:24:53


 


What about people who can't work from home? What about the doctors and nurses who need to get to work? How are those people supposed to get around?


Originally Posted by: westv 


 


From what I gather from the lockdown in other countries, you can travel to work if you print out and produce evidence you are going straight to work

SOakley
19 March 2020 01:32:26


France is concerned about what people will get up to with all the spare time on their hands, so has announced the following:


"With all that home confinement, the French government has decided to relax rules on contraception in an apparent bid to avoid an unwanted pregnancy spike. 


Marlène Schiappa, the gender equality minister, has issued a statement saying that women can use old prescriptions to directly pick up new stocks of the contraceptive pill from chemists without going through a doctor in order to reduce their workload and risk of contagion."


- looks odd to me though - given demographics in most European countries, surely having a baby boom would be of long term benefit?


Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum 


 


 


 I know accidents can happen, but who in their right mind would plan to conceive a child in the current state of affairs

Quantum
19 March 2020 01:41:15


 


I wish he would just say it out loud. These two clowns have totally arsed up, though perhaps they were following orders from Rasputin


Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


Yes but to be fair how many people, back in January, actually took this seriously?


Trying to get people to take it seriously was a losing battle. Pretty much everyone compared it to the flu back then.


 


2024/2025 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp): Total: 3 days with snow/sleet falling
18/11 (-6), 19/11 (-6), 23/11 (-2)
2023/2024 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp): Total: 8 days with snow/sleet falling
29/11 (-6), 30/11 (-6), 02/12 (-5), 03/12 (-5), 04/12 (-3), 16/01 (-3), 18/01 (-8), 08/02 (-5)
2022/2023 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp): Total: 7 days with snow/sleet falling.
18/12 (-1), 06/03 (-6), 08/03 (-8), 09/03 (-6), 10/03 (-8), 11/03 (-5), 14/03 (-6)
2021/2022 Snow days (approx 850hpa temp): Total: 12 days with snow/sleet falling.
26/11 (-5), 27/11 (-7), 28/11 (-6), 02/12 (-6), 06/01 (-5), 07/01 (-6), 06/02 (-5), 19/02 (-5), 24/02 (-7), 30/03 (-7), 31/03 (-8), 01/04 (-8)
Justin W
19 March 2020 06:09:03


 



If pubs are open, do you seriously expect plebs not to use them?  Blame Boris, not the punters


Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 


I expect people to behave responsibly and decently during a pandemic. I expect them to do everything they can to minimise the possibility of spreading the virus. I expect them to try their best not to be responsible for condemning more vulnerable to death than are already going to die. We have been told it is vital to minimise social contact and that means not going to pubs, clubs, restaurants.


But you don’t seem to be able to take responsibility for your own behaviour. You are waiting to be physically prevented from going to the pub because you are a child who has clearly never had to grow up. Worse, you come on here and brag about it.


Somebody in your group of fellow cretins will be carrying the virus and will show symptoms soon enough. It may be you. Within 30 days, you will have been responsible for its transmission to 30,000 people after passing it on to 2 or 3 people from one evening in the pub.


I blame HMG for not acting more quickly. But I most certainly blame you for being a selfish and juvenile man.


Grow the f4ck up.


Yo yo yo. 148-3 to the 3 to the 6 to the 9, representing the ABQ, what up, biatch?
Justin W
19 March 2020 06:21:35


Yo yo yo. 148-3 to the 3 to the 6 to the 9, representing the ABQ, what up, biatch?

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