I really   think you are giving them too much credit  here -I  don't think they are that clever -  I'm pretty sure nobody was more  surprised  than Cameron  when he ended up with a working majority !

Originally Posted by: Bugglesgate 

I really   think you are giving them too much credit  here -I  don't think they are that clever -  I'm pretty sure nobody was more  surprised  than Cameron  when he ended up with a working majority !

Originally Posted by: Bugglesgate 

The "plebs" have not listened to the message:

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum 

Quite! Nobody could have predicted the fall out from the Scottish referendum. Besides, even if Labour had won every seat in Scotland, they would still not be able to form a Government today.

What nobody expected was that the collapse in the LibDem support would benefit the Tories to the extent in which it did.

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum 

Quite! Nobody could have predicted the fall out from the Scottish referendum. Besides, even if Labour had won every seat in Scotland, they would still not be able to form a Government today.

What nobody expected was that the collapse in the LibDem support would benefit the Tories to the extent in which it did.

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum 

The biggest joke was Cameron bullshitting on this morning about wanting to be a one nation Tory and to work for our United Kingdom.

I realise the Tories are shameless.  I realise they have cannibalised their bedfellows the Lib Dems in the pursuit of power.  They strategized to unleash the nationalist beast in Scotland via the referendum and knowing where the end game of that play would leave Labour, again, all about power and nothing to do with the lies Cameron was spewing this morning.

Personally financially I will be better off this morning under a new Tory administration IF they keep to their bribes from the election period.

But I voted to support the more vulnerable members of our society for whom I now genuinely fear in a Tory government with out the sanitizing influence of the now cannibalised Lib Dems.

A sad day and a worrying future for Britain.

Originally Posted by: Whether Idle 

Quite! Nobody could have predicted the fall out from the Scottish referendum. Besides, even if Labour had won every seat in Scotland, they would still not be able to form a Government today.

What nobody expected was that the collapse in the LibDem support would benefit the Tories to the extent in which it did.

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum 

Yesterday when you thought you had lost, you were dissing the thick voters as well!

Its all a bit different now isnt it?

Anyway, just had an interesting conversation with two of my pub geezers. They voted Tory but were not celebrating. They thought they were voting for a continuation of the Coalition. They were worried about the Tories governing alone - "They can do as they like now".

Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 

One of the first things the ConDem coalition did when they got in was tinker with the rules to make getting rid of them harder - and making sure they stayed in power for 5 years. It left a bit of a nasty taste in the mouth for me.

Again, the Tories are at it straight away.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/11593496/New-Commons-boundaries-top-Conservative-government-agenda.html

"Redrawing constituency boundaries to lock Labour out of power for a decades (sic) is at the top of the agenda for the new Conservative government, senior Tories have said."

I can think of many priorities, but tinkering with the boundaries to "lock Labour out for decades" isn't one of them.

"Giving new powers to the police and security services to monitor electronic communications -- dubbed the “snooper’s charter” by critics -- will also be high on the Tory agenda. Abolishing the Human Rights Act and implementing a British Bill of Rights is also on the list. "

Translation: "We want everyone to use encryption all the time so we can't snoop on them" and "We know the HRA isn't popular, but we're bound under EU law to implement most of it so we'll just create a similarly-themed Bill of Rights in the hope that nobody will notice". Hoorah for politics!

Originally Posted by: Retron 

Im sure behind closed doors that theirs was a 2 pronged strategy for the election of merciless targeting of Lib dem seats and talking up the anti Scottish rhetoric knowing it would add fire to the Scot's determination to be "strong" and smash all  and sundry -conveniently Labour.

I am not disputing that Labour were uninspiring and on that basis I m not sure their message deserved victory.  Milliband has obvious weaknesses as a leader (or did have), but it was Cameron's lies this morning that grated and need to be pointed out.

Originally Posted by: Whether Idle 

When it comes to the result, I repeatedly said that I could detect no enthusiasm for Labour - normally an opposition party about to be elected, has an enthusiastic following in the streets. But I saw no Labour posters in the windows or Labour people out in the streets pressing the flesh and selling their wares. I did think Miliband could end up in Number Ten by mistake, particularly given the useless Tory election campaign, but when all was said and done people voted for the more competent party.

Labour has a problem as we have discussed - the English want aspirational politics, they want opportunity, they are not enthused by high taxes and redistribution, they want the chance to prosper themselves and don't hate the wealthy. Having a platform to clobber the rich may go down well with Labour Party activists, but it doesn't go down well with Middle England, who rather than clobbering the rich, want to be wealthy too.

Scotland is a different matter. As Nick suggested, Labour had better make Scottish Labour a wholly separate and independent party designed to appeal to the Scottish voter, just as the Sun supported the Tories in England and the SNP in Scotland.

Instead of blaming everyone else, Labour should reflect on itself and its own message - Blairism is a winning formula in England, whereas Brownism (of which Milibandism was a derivitive) is not.

Originally Posted by: Maunder Minimum 

Here's how the Council results are looking so far (and it legally reflects the GE picture). It is unusual for an incumbent party to do so well in local elections as far as I am aware.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election/2015/results/councils

There must be an awful lot of evil, stupid, naive and selfish voters out there eh?

Originally Posted by: doctormog 

On this we can agree for a change!

I think England can only be won from the Centre. An SNP style party could never win here, even though I would personally like to see more radicalism, it makes you unelectable in England.

Thats why Labour needs to go for a centrist pro-business candidate with TV appeal and some Hollywood startdust. That could be Chuka. He will also get an easier ride from the Right wing press because of his background and the romance of being the first black party leader

But I think Burnham is the better all round candidate though.

Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 

The biggest joke was Cameron bullshitting on this morning about wanting to be a one nation Tory and to work for our United Kingdom.

I realise the Tories are shameless.  I realise they have cannibalised their bedfellows the Lib Dems in the pursuit of power.  They strategized to unleash the nationalist beast in Scotland via the referendum and knowing where the end game of that play would leave Labour, again, all about power and nothing to do with the lies Cameron was spewing this morning.

Personally financially I will be better off this morning under a new Tory administration IF they keep to their bribes from the election period.

But I voted to support the more vulnerable members of our society for whom I now genuinely fear in a Tory government with out the sanitizing influence of the now cannibalised Lib Dems.

A sad day and a worrying future for Britain.

Originally Posted by: Whether Idle 

The people to blame for the state of Labour in Scotland is Labour. They took the Scots for granted by giving them devolution that was suppose to lance the SNP boil, thinking Scotland will always vote Labour and having a bunch of second stringers in charge of it all.

Arrogance, ignorance and taking for granted Scotland has cost Labour dearly.

Originally Posted by: KevBrads1 

Here's how the Council results are looking so far (and it legally reflects the GE picture). It is unusual for an incumbent party to do so well in local elections as far as I am aware.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election/2015/results/councils

There must be an awful lot of evil, stupid, naive and selfish voters out there eh?

Originally Posted by: doctormog 

It defies logic!

Are we living in North Korea? Have the votes actually been counted properly!

I cannot believe the Tories have done so well

Originally Posted by: The Beast from the East 

One of the first things the ConDem coalition did when they got in was tinker with the rules to make getting rid of them harder - and making sure they stayed in power for 5 years. It left a bit of a nasty taste in the mouth for me.

Again, the Tories are at it straight away.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/11593496/New-Commons-boundaries-top-Conservative-government-agenda.html

"Redrawing constituency boundaries to lock Labour out of power for a decades (sic) is at the top of the agenda for the new Conservative government, senior Tories have said."

I can think of many priorities, but tinkering with the boundaries to "lock Labour out for decades" isn't one of them.

"Giving new powers to the police and security services to monitor electronic communications -- dubbed the “snooper’s charter” by critics -- will also be high on the Tory agenda. Abolishing the Human Rights Act and implementing a British Bill of Rights is also on the list. "

Translation: "We want everyone to use encryption all the time so we can't snoop on them" and "We know the HRA isn't popular, but we're bound under EU law to implement most of it so we'll just create a similarly-themed Bill of Rights in the hope that nobody will notice". Hoorah for politics!

Originally Posted by: Retron 

Ed Miliband was just not seen as a credible alternative.

30.5% of the vote, worse than Kinnock in 1987 who got 30.8%

Labour's 3rd worst share of the vote at an election since WWII

The stone tablet was a stunt that went too far but to say you were going to put it in Downing St just showed a complete lack of nous.

I'm not saying it solely cost them the election but to me it just emphasise that Miliband was not credible if he thought that was a good idea.

Originally Posted by: KevBrads1