Remove ads from site

Stormchaser
05 August 2015 19:25:02

Lets see... what can we gain from looking at the MJO this evening?



Ah. Not much then 


UKMO, the only model that was showing a strong event in the Pacific in line with an El Nino environment, has gone AWOL.


ECM's got it totally stalled out for the next 14 days which would be very unusual.


GEFS are taking it to the Indian Ocean as if there was a La Nina in place. In theory this is a lot less likely to occur than a stay in the Pacific, but you never know I suppose.


 


For a true understanding of the state of the atmospheric pattern, a plot of the Global Wind Oscillations is preferable. Generally speaking, when the rate of mass transport (dM/dt) cycles at high levels of AAM (top half of the plot area), you've got an El Nino type setup in place. If it circles in the bottom half, you have a La Nina type setup, which was evident up until late June this year.



It was as this entered the positive realm of orbit that we saw improved prospects to start July, as a high AAM orbit in mid to late summer tends to favour ridges of high pressure from Europe to the vicinity of the UK.


Trouble is, within this there can be significant variation in the strength of that ridge and its northward extent, this relating to the movement of the AAM between phases 5 and 8. I'm not 100% sure but I think phases 5/6 are good for the high extending up to the UK in July/August, while 7/8 favour a stronger jet in the Atlantic tending to flatten the ridge.


If I'm right about that, then last month we could have done with the GWO sticking close to or ideally within 5/6 and moving along nice and slow, rather than heading all the way over to phase 8 at a fair old pace (http://www.atmos.albany.edu/student/nschiral/research/gwo/prev60_phase.png - trace the red line back until it meets the green one)

I reckon the N. Atlantic SST situation then took things a step further than we'd normally experience - just hard luck I'm afraid!


 


At the moment the outlook from GEFS (above displayed image) shows another fast orbit through phases 7-8 which seems to tie in with the weekend ridge having a hard time getting a foothold. Yet then we see the GWO becoming slow moving in the phase 6/7 region while just below the threshold where it has significant influence (some call this phase 0)... perhaps weakly favouring ridges over Europe coming and going. This has certainly been a common theme in recent GFS op runs, though the 12z has gone off on one which lowers the confidence level right after it was just starting to climb 


 


So concludes my attempt to describe and make use of what is undeniably a very complicated but also very insightful measure of the atmosphere. Don't worry if a lot has gone over your head - I've been looking at it from time to time for more than 12 months and it still isn't entirely clear to me 


 


If you have any problems or queries relating to TWO you can Email [email protected]

https://twitter.com/peacockreports 
2023's Homeland Extremes:
T-Max: 30.2°C 9th Sep (...!) | T-Min: -7.1°C 22nd & 23rd Jan | Wettest Day: 25.9mm 2nd Nov | Ice Days: 1 (2nd Dec -1.3°C in freezing fog)
Keep Calm and Forecast On
bledur
05 August 2015 19:27:12

Looks like the heat staying over Europe although the S.E and east anglia might catch a bit . Cool out to the west.


Sinky1970
05 August 2015 21:45:31
I think i'm going to forget "summer" in this part of the world this year, the unsettled theme seems to go on and on.
Whether Idle
05 August 2015 21:50:50

 


Here is the ECM for a week's time: +15 850s well into the SE.  This would represent a further improvement on what is becoming the best summer locally for a long while; with 3 above average mean temperature summer months looking a distinct possibility



Dover, 5m asl. Half a mile from the south coast.
Matty H
  • Matty H
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
05 August 2015 23:54:27

There's a very simple rule of thumb - if anything can wrong in our bollox climate it will. On the basis of that the GFS is the form horse and forget about any prolonged warm/heat wave. 


Jiries
06 August 2015 07:20:36


There's a very simple rule of thumb - if anything can wrong in our bollox climate it will. On the basis of that the GFS is the form horse and forget about any prolonged warm/heat wave. 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rhgfs1864.gif


Dodgy temps once again and thankfully the wrong charts are in FI while UKMO are keeping the projected hot weather while GEM keep it clean and simple with prolonged HP days.  I am going for those 2 as we are over due for nationwide HP days, until now it haven't arrived yet this month despite Met kept going on about settled August.  GFS have a extreme heat at the end but it been showing this to occur from mid August for few days now, it a outlier at the moment but if this showing again and again the more members will join the 20C uppers. 

Matty H
  • Matty H
  • Advanced Member Topic Starter
06 August 2015 07:29:25

Predictably UKMO not as good this morning. The Azores high doesn't make it. GFS just looks a complicated mess. Can't even be bothered to look at ECM


Tim A
06 August 2015 07:42:52
The fact that that temp anomaly chart posted by Bledur above has completely flipped shows how useless looking ahead is at this moment.
Tim
NW Leeds
187m asl

 My PWS 
doctormog
06 August 2015 07:43:13
Yes, unfortunately every set of runs that goes past shows high pressure less influential over the UK.
Sinky1970
06 August 2015 08:03:53
Getting temperatures even close to average is a bonus, especially in the western half of the country, this country really is dire.
doctormog
06 August 2015 08:16:36

Getting temperatures even close to average is a bonus, especially in the western half of the country, this country really is dire.

Originally Posted by: Sinky1970 


Yes, if this summer could be summed up in a picture it would be the temperature anomaly chart for the coming 7 days (the third picture)


http://wxmaps.org/pix/temp4.html 


 


David M Porter
06 August 2015 08:32:49

While we don't look like getting the holy grail of settled spells according to the models, what I would say is that prospects for next week do generally look a bit better than they have done for the last half-a-dozen weeks, especially for northern areas. The jet stream looks like returning to something nearer it's normal path for the time of year for one thing and pressure over the Greenland region looks lower than it has done at any time since mid-June.


I think that, given what we've had recently, it helps if we keep our expectations in perspective. Where I lve, we've had a grand total of 3 dry days in 3 weeks!


Lenzie, Glasgow

"Let us not take ourselves too seriously. None of us has a monopoly on wisdom, and we must always be ready to listen and respect other points of view."- Queen Elizabeth II 1926-2022
GIBBY
06 August 2015 08:43:33

HERE IS MY LATEST ANALYSIS USING DATA SUPPLIED BY THE NWP OUTPUT COVERING 5 OF THE WORLDS MOST POWERFUL WEATHER COMPUTERS ISSUED AT 08:00 ON THURSDAY AUG 6TH 2015.


THE CURRENT GENERAL SITUATION. A depression lies close to Southern Iceland with a WSW flow across the UK weakening slowly. A new but weakening depression will drifts towards SW England later tonight and tomorrow.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn001.gif


MODELS-2 WEEK HEADLINE Remaining rather changeable with rain at times especially over the North and West. Some dry and at times warmer conditions as well especially over the South and East.


THE GFS JET STREAM FORECAST The GFS Jet Stream Forecast shows the flow still blowing NE across Southern Britain over the next day or so. It then relocates further NW near Scotland at the weekend slipping back slowly SE early next week. This portion of the flow also weakens through next week with a new arm well to the NW which later dips sharply South over the Atlantic and returning North close to western Britain late in week 2.


http://www.netweather.tv/index.cgi?action=jetstream


GFS OPERATIONAL The GFS Operational Run today shows a ridge developing close to Southern Britain at the weekend. At the same time troughs n a strong WSW flow over the North work their way SE over the UK weakening as they do. By midweek pressure is building NE across the UK with a High forming to the East of the UK by next weekend. pressure then falls to the West and SW with a more unsettled and cooler phase for most parts. Pressure then recovers well in the second week, again to the East and sending very warm or hot air across the UK before a thundery low moves North into Southern areas at the end of the period.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn1441.gif


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn3841.gif


THE GFS CONTROL The GFS Control Run shows a ridge too developing close to Southern Britain with things warming up down here and becoming quite humid and sometimes rather cloudy over the weekend and next week. The North remains more changeable with rain at times up to midweek. The Control Run diverges somewhat from the Operational from then on keeping pressure very slack across the UK and with weak Low pressure floating about some showers, thundery in places are likely most days before a deep Low over the Atlantic through the second week freshens things up somewhat in a SW breeze and rain at times chiefly in the North and West.


THE GFS CLUSTERS(14 Days) The GFS Clusters this morning for 14 days still show a lot of High pressure dominance across the UK in the shape of a ridge of High pressure with the greatest chance of any divergence from this pattern likely from Low pressure to the North of the UK affecting the North.


http://www.weatheronline.co.uk/cgi-bin/expertcharts?LANG=en&MENU=0000000000&CONT=euro&MODELL=gefs&MODELLTYP=2&BASE=-&VAR=cpre&HH=372&ZOOM=0&ARCHIV=0&RES=0&WMO=&PERIOD=


UKMO UKMO today shows High pressure ridging across the far South at the weekend with a fresh WSW flow across the North with rain at times. As the troughs bringing this rain weakens by midweek next week the WSW flow decays and is replaced by a High pressure ridge across the Central swathe of the UK. Thundery Low pressure may creep up from Europe to affect the South while the best weather for once may be over Scotland later next week with warm conditions for most of the UK by then.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rukm1441.gif


THE FAX CHARTS The Fax Charts this morning show weakening fronts moving SE across the UK at the weekend and becoming slow moving over Southern England by Monday.


http://www.weathercharts.org/ukmomslp.htm#t120.


GEM GEM today offers a similar pattern to the rest giving the South a fine and warm weekend and start to next week. The WSW flow in the North will decay by midweek as pressure patterns become slack across the UK. Apart from the risk of the odd thundery shower breaking out in the South at times the rest of the run seems set fair with High pressure ridging across the UK ensuring fine and warm weather for many with just the far North at risk of some rain by the end of the run as troughs to the North skirt by.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rgem2401.gif


NAVGEM NAVGEM shows the build of pressure too from the SW across the far South of Britain at the weekend with the unsettled WSW flow further North weakening through the early days of next week leading to a spell of benign conditions across the UK as a tenuous ridge of High pressure develops across the UK giving light winds and sunny spells and generally reasonably warm conditions.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rnvg1681.gif.


ECM ECM this morning offers up a two pronged attack from a ridge of High pressure from the SW today. In the first instance at the weekend only the far South sees the benefits as the warm conditions here will not be replicated elsewhere. Instead troughs will bring rain at times in a SW breeze to all areas away from the far South and SE. This pattern then subsides by midweek as pressure becomes slack everywhere with the risk of a few showers for a time. The second ridge from the SW is then shown better aligned to bring all of the UK into fine and warm weather before it too declines to a much more unsettled period late next week and over the weekend as rain or thundery showers become much more prolific as Low pressure crosses and lies to the West of the UK.


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Recm2401.gif


ECM 10 DAY MEAN The ECM 10 Day Mean Chart  this morning shows the same pattern as previously for the position we're likely to lie under in 10 days time. Low pressure is shown up to the NW with a trough close to Western Britain with slack winds across the UK. With pressure between it's members ranging from 1005mbs in the far NW to 1015 in the far SW no doubt some showery rain and temperatures close to average and at best only slightly above seem the likely result of such a pattern


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Reem2401.gif


NOTABLE TREND CHANGES FROM PREVIOUS RUNS The models continue to show some improvements across the UK today though there is varying degrees of extent and duration of this theme.


31 DAY HISTORICAL VERIFICATION STATS FOR GFS, UKMO & ECM The Verification Statistics of GFS, UKMO and ECM. This morning's verification statistics show ECM leading the way at 3 days with 95.9 pts followed by UKMO at 95.5 pts and GFS at 94.7 pts. At 5 days ECM is stll king at 86.6 pts followed by GFS at 83.4 and UKMO at 83.3 pts. Then at 8 Days ECM still leads at 58.2 pts over GFS's 53.4 pts. Finally at Day 10 ECM leads GFS at 38.7 pts to 33.3 pts from GFS.
 
http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS_vsdb/allmodel/daily/cor/cor_day3_PMSL_MSL_G2NHX.png


http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS_vsdb/allmodel/daily/cor/cor_day5_PMSL_MSL_G2NHX.png


http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS_vsdb/allmodel/daily/cor/cor_day8_PMSL_MSL_G2NHX.png


http://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/gmb/STATS_vsdb/allmodel/daily/cor/cor_day10_PMSL_MSL_G2NHX.prig
 
MY THOUGHTS I find the long term projections of the models very hard to quantify this morning as they offer a more than usual degree of uncertainty with regard to specific details as we move from the second weekend and through into the following week. There is a degree of certainty on the fact that pressure is going to build strongly close to Southern Britain at the weekend with increasingly warm and humid weather as a result down here. There is also agreement on troughs moving down into this High pressure from the NW giving rise to a lot of cloud and some rain across the North and West. From that point on models start to diverge somewhat on specifics but in general do indicate a period of slack pressure and the risk of showers for a time before a second build of pressure from the SW looks likely towards the end of next week. Being better aligned on a trajectory that includes all of the UK sharing in some fine and warm conditions one would think that it might hang around in situ for a while but the output which extends beyond that point quickly show it breaking down into lower pressure again, be it from the NW, West or South with rain at times, some thundery returning quite widely across the UK. It seems an almost impossible task for the models to hold enough High pressure across the UK for any length of time this Summer to give the UK a decent and extended period of Summer weather. Nevertheless, for Northern locations there is at least some prospect of some better days than of late with temperatures eventually entering the warm category here too though patience until the end of next week will have to be adhered. For the South things remain acceptable with just some occasional perhaps thundery rain and some occasional if short bursts of very warm or hot weather possible at times. Looking on a broad scale judgement however you dress this Summer up and it has been OK down here in the South for much of the time there has certainly been a drought in the amount of dominant High Pressure lying across the UK this year with the best weather always lying just the other side of the channel on mainland Europe and while for many Northerners it has been one to forget it certainly won't go down as being noteworthy down here either especially in terms of long term average temperatures despite below average rainfall. While this morning's output will deliver improvements for the North in the coming weeks the South will probably notice the difference rather less as to me there still doesn't look like any sustained and guaranteed hot conditions other than the odd day between much more average sort of conditions for August.


Next update from 09:00 Friday Aug 7th 2015


Martin G
Kilmersdon Radstock Bath Somerset



Look up my New Facebook Weather Page  for all the latest up to the minute weather stories as they happen
Gavin P
06 August 2015 11:38:27

Hi all,


Here's today's video update;


Warmer and drier next week;



Looks like a fairly nice week though maybe "wobbling" later...


Video start's off with a look at TWO's fantastic new Hi-Def charts!


Rural West Northants 120m asl
Short, medium and long range weather forecast videos @ https://www.youtube.com/user/GavsWeatherVids
ghawes
06 August 2015 12:26:39


I think that, given what we've had recently, it helps if we keep our expectations in perspective. Where I lve, we've had a grand total of 3 dry days in 3 weeks!


Originally Posted by: David M Porter 


Yes and here we've had one day reach 20c since July 11th!


I agree though, it does look a bit better over the coming 10 days or so. The 6z GFS paints a pretty dry picture for here.


Graeme
East Neuk of Fife



Chunky Pea
06 August 2015 16:02:27
Looking at the EC mean out to 15 days, there seems to be a recent trend for troughing to deepen somewhat in the western Atlantic while the mean position of the Icelandic low shifts a small bit west as we head into the 2nd half of August. If this was to pan out as modeled, it could have one of two possible effects. 1. the western Atlantic trough could help draw up warmer, more stable air over NW Europe if troughing to the north weakens, or 2. the western Atlantic trough could feed warm, unstable energy into into the mid Atlantic jet and steer deep depressions towards NW Europe if troughing between Iceland & Scandinavia fails to weaken significantly. Either way, temps forecast to recover towards mid-month - until the next run at least!
Current Conditions
https://t.ly/MEYqg 


"You don't have to know anything to have an opinion"
--Roger P, 12/Oct/2022
Whether Idle
06 August 2015 19:23:10

12z GFS accumulated precip.  Looking mainly dry for many, with many places less than 2mm over the next  almost 5 days.


The summer of the  Tees-Ex line continues


Modele GFS - Carte prévisions


Dover, 5m asl. Half a mile from the south coast.
Cumbrian Snowman
06 August 2015 19:25:38

My Geography teacher always went on about the Ex-Tees line, never heard anybody else mention it until today, 40yrs later. But its true and does happen alot


LeedsLad123
06 August 2015 19:37:44

The Tees-Exe line actually refers to geography, north of the line is upland, south is lowland, but in terms of weather it makes sense too. Today was a good example of that - we had sunny spells and a top temp of around 22C, while Manchester hovered around 18-19C.


Whitkirk, Leeds - 85m ASL.
Whether Idle
06 August 2015 19:52:16


The Tees-Exe line actually refers to geography, north of the line is upland, south is lowland, but in terms of weather it makes sense too. Today was a good example of that - we had sunny spells and a top temp of around 22C, while Manchester hovered around 18-19C.


Originally Posted by: LeedsLad123 


The Tees-Exe line is applicable in terms of geology, rainfall, relief and a number of other things besides, Im sure people could offer many.  But yes, its a useful geographical tool.


Dover, 5m asl. Half a mile from the south coast.
Stormchaser
06 August 2015 19:59:43

Plenty of satisfactory warmth on offer from GFS this evening, but ECM's thrown out a bit of a wildcard as it makes a lot more of a shortwave feature running N of the UK, throwing more in the way of Atlantic air across us accompanied by some rain and showers.


Not only that but the run is very aggressive with the Atlantic trough from day 6 onward. It's in line with a recent GFS trend but for day 6 (Wednesday) has deepened the low 5mb further than GFS has dared to on any op run so far.


UKMO has the weakest trough and so looks most promising going forward:


Modele UKMO - Carte prévisions


Hopefully we'll at least see the trough holding back further west than ECM shows - something more like GFS is fair enough I feel. I like how that model keeps things interesting during lower-res (days 10-16) as well.


In theory, the expected GWO evolution that I talked about yesterday evening should support the trough tending to back west, indeed the whole pattern doing so, with hot air edging in from SE of the UK generally. Having said that, the AAM could do with being more positive... but past performances do suggest that the AAM is often underdone in the forecasts - so I can see reasons to be hopeful despite the ECM trend (and GEM's pretty vicious by days 9-10 too).


If you have any problems or queries relating to TWO you can Email [email protected]

https://twitter.com/peacockreports 
2023's Homeland Extremes:
T-Max: 30.2°C 9th Sep (...!) | T-Min: -7.1°C 22nd & 23rd Jan | Wettest Day: 25.9mm 2nd Nov | Ice Days: 1 (2nd Dec -1.3°C in freezing fog)
Keep Calm and Forecast On
Sinky1970
07 August 2015 06:47:03
Looking at GFS this morning it looks like the southern and eastern half of the country has got the best deal again.
David M Porter
07 August 2015 07:36:09

Looking at GFS this morning it looks like the southern and eastern half of the country has got the best deal again.

Originally Posted by: Sinky1970 


ECM and UKMO 00z op runs don't look too bad though for next week, especially the latter.


Lenzie, Glasgow

"Let us not take ourselves too seriously. None of us has a monopoly on wisdom, and we must always be ready to listen and respect other points of view."- Queen Elizabeth II 1926-2022
Jiries
07 August 2015 07:41:11

Looking at GFS this morning it looks like the southern and eastern half of the country has got the best deal again.

Originally Posted by: Sinky1970 


More like bad deal to me as if you see UK should had got this heat nationwide instead of living off warm crumbs from the continent which are useless and boring set-up. 


http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn2102.gif


20C almost everywhere if this LP didn't have to be too near and denied us getting this but allowed Scandi getting all the heat nationwide.  I would imagine Scotland would be enjoying low 30's which have a right to deserve this after a very poor summer up there and mid to high 30's here in London very easily as we have a right to be member of the EU heat like we used to get easily in the 90's nationwide hot spells.


 

Stormchaser
07 August 2015 08:05:47
ECM is still making a lot more of the secondary low on the s. flank of the main Atlantic trough Sun-Mon.

It digs south and wedges in between the HP ridges east and west of the UK. The resultant cool westerlies and precipitation are experienced a long way further SE than seen in the GFS and UKMO output, which barely develop the low and keep it to the N, the Midlands south escaping much impact and S. England holding into some very warm conditions.

I struggle to recall the last time ECM treated a feature so differently to the other models at just 3-4 days range.


Later in time, issues remain regarding the strength of the jet stream, with recent GFS op runs rather flat, the 00z of yesterday being the last to show us what a buckling of the jet could lead to given the excess heat to our S and SE.
If you have any problems or queries relating to TWO you can Email [email protected]

https://twitter.com/peacockreports 
2023's Homeland Extremes:
T-Max: 30.2°C 9th Sep (...!) | T-Min: -7.1°C 22nd & 23rd Jan | Wettest Day: 25.9mm 2nd Nov | Ice Days: 1 (2nd Dec -1.3°C in freezing fog)
Keep Calm and Forecast On

Remove ads from site

Ads