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soperman
26 January 2015 19:09:09

Yep. The 0zs appeared to be a cross model downgrade but fuelled solely by shortwaves creating the toppler. 


The Gfs 6z bucked that trend and these 12z are certainly an upgrade and have captured my interest. Tonights ENS will be revealing

kmoorman
26 January 2015 19:09:58


Good output tonight for us cold lovers, snow could crop up anywhere in this sort of set up


Originally Posted by: Gooner 


Do you know what? I bloomin well hope so.


Im happy with the developments so far today. the 850 temps are looking better medium term.


 


 


Home: Durrington, Worthing, West Sussex. (16 ASL)
Work: Canary Wharf, London
Follow me on Twitter @kmoorman1968
Sinky1970
26 January 2015 19:18:16
I'm just hoping to see a bit of falling snow before my brain op in 2 weeks time.
soperman
26 January 2015 19:18:58

Temps down too? Ice days Monday and Tuesday quite widely 


Talk of Polar Low. I think there is a chance of a channel low in the instability although flow may be unfavourable.

Chiltern Blizzard
26 January 2015 19:29:57

I'm just hoping to see a bit of falling snow before my brain op in 2 weeks time.

Originally Posted by: Sinky1970 


i'm hoping for some lying snow! Too much to ask? Best chance since 2013 now surely... Best wishes for the op btw


Rendlesham, Suffolk 20m asl
sizzle
26 January 2015 19:45:31

I cant see the south getting much snow TBH if any.  it remains to the N/NE/NW  of the UK.

sizzle
26 January 2015 19:50:41

some intresting murr posts fom NW -----


so when the front clears weds eve- expect a dramatic drop of air & dewpoint from +8c to -3c


 


12pm Weds


http://modeles2.mete...101UK.GIF?26-12


 


15PM Weds


http://modeles2.mete...101UK.GIF?26-12


 


overnight temps plummet in clear air before a period of snow moves in


http://modeles2.mete...779UK.GIF?26-12


 


May well give a dusting- at least the first meaningful snow falling for 2 years.


 


Post that, UKMO brings us a potent arctic blast that would certainly again see snow falling across the region.- At that point we need a bit of timing & luck to see snow cover-


The best 850 GFS chart for some time


http://modeles2.mete...8-7UK.GIF?26-12


deep cold uppers ( -11c) spreading south- very negative dewpoints- so any PPN falling would be snow.


 


Looking nice at this stage...


 


We should start seeing some pinks across the SE on the Euro 4 from the 00z run....


 


ECM to 72 has -6c uppers remaining in the SE


http://www.meteociel...612/ECU0-72.GIF


 
ECM 144 looks potentially great with the icelandic shortwave looking alligned SSE to crosd the uk with ridging behind

Could be good..... 

kal
26 January 2015 19:57:28

That really is a true cold front to sweep through wed pm!!!!!

roger63
26 January 2015 20:05:14

A couple of points of interest.


A small LP appears on some of the GEFS ens running SE south of UK on some members.Could that bring enhanced snow activity in the south if it comes off.GEFS also shows some cold ens with easterly appearing at both 240 and 360h- but in the minority at present. Also ens show Some very low temperatures over Grreenland < -40C.


 

Gooner
26 January 2015 20:11:19


ECM 12Z compared to GFS 12Z is poor for cold in the northerly. The real cold upper air from north of Svarlbard does not make it to the UK. 


It's a big ask for this to happen, and it does so rarely. GFS might be right, but I doubt it. As ever lots of scope before this is nailed.


As usual this winter the big problem is the distance any real cold air has to travel through the mean streets to reach the UK without being mugged.


Originally Posted by: RobN 


I think you should move in with Mike, it is hardly poor


Blimey


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


Stormchaser
26 January 2015 20:35:51

Much of the improvement compared to the 00z runs comes from the western N. Atlantic trough being aligned well to throw some warm air advection up the west side of the mid-Atlantic ridge, allowing it to hold on even with shortwave lows cutting through it.


The JMA 12z hasn't followed this trend so makes a good reminder of what we don't want to see.


 


Shorter term, regardless of what S. Murr has posted (based on GFS...), WRF-NMM continues to trouble me with it's positive dew point values for Wednesday night across much of Cornwall, Devon, CS and SE England. Not quite as bad as the past couple of runs, with some snow shown from a bit of heavier precipitation for a time, but still suggesting that accumulations would be slim to none.


While an issue with modelling the effect of the bordering ocean and seas on dew points may be having a significant impact, there is also a significant disagreement in terms of wind direction; WRF-NMM is showing a SW wind 3-6am when GFS has a WNW wind. That slight difference could be critical - in fact I remember yesterday's NMM 06z had snow right down to the coast in a WNW wind.


So the usual uncertainty reigns supreme and keeps me guessing until the potential is on my doorstep. As usual, the instinctive response is to expect nothing much, roll the eyes, and carry on in 'business as usual' mode.


 


So looking further ahead again, Friday is looking cold but not markedly so, with air temperatures as high as 6*C in the south. Dew points of near zero may give a slight 'continental' feel to the conditions with any well-shaded frost or lying snow able to hang on through the day. Any showers getting inland are likely to be wintry in nature - so a mix of rain, sleet, soft hail and snow, varying between locations. Windward coasts may see a lot of showers but these appear likely to fall as rain in England and Wales, snow reserved for Scotland.


Saturday may see an area of higher DPs drift down across the UK, which will result in some unwanted thawing of any remaining lying snow should it transpire. GFS makes a lot less of this on the 12z compared to the 06z, but it still looks to be present on the ECM 12z.


The culprit is a secondary low developing over the UK, which mixes out the low-level cold.


 


Sunday now looks increasingly cold from the north, but beyond that the details are impossible to pin down aside from the lowest temperatures being in the far north and the highest in the far south.


 


Overall, the Wed-Sat period is currently looking likely to be a very tame cold spell across low levels in the south, unless the convection early Thursday turns out to be heavier than the models currently indicate, in which case there is some scope for rapid accumulations of 2-5cm in spots that get lucky. 


As usual, the prospects improve as you head north, though from the looks of things not by a lot until you're up near or in Scotland.


I will admit, taking such a critical, level-headed approach does become tedious at times like this 


If you have any problems or queries relating to TWO you can Email [email protected]

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2023's Homeland Extremes:
T-Max: 30.2°C 9th Sep (...!) | T-Min: -7.1°C 22nd & 23rd Jan | Wettest Day: 25.9mm 2nd Nov | Ice Days: 1 (2nd Dec -1.3°C in freezing fog)
Keep Calm and Forecast On
cultman1
26 January 2015 20:46:19
Stormchaser , you are being very pessimistic for us Southerners. you may well be right but from what I read this cold spell for the south of England is hardly worth mentioning at al...l you quote 'very tame cold spell'. In other words nothing much temperature and precipitation wise for the South of UK, yet many other posters and indeed the Met Office seem to imply a rather different view. I do find it frustrating and confusing when there is such a difference in poster's views on this forum. So often the final result is somewhat different!
Matty H
26 January 2015 20:51:07

Sensible and realistic post, James. Your contributions to this thread are always a breath of fresh air 


Bugglesgate
26 January 2015 20:55:31


Sensible and realistic post, James. Your contributions to this thread are always a breath of fresh air 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 


 


Seconded


Chris (It,its)
Between Newbury and Basingstoke
"When they are giving you their all, some stagger and fall, after all it's not easy banging your heart against some mad buggers wall"
sizzle
26 January 2015 20:55:49


Sensible and realistic post, James. Your contributions to this thread are always a breath of fresh air 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 

absolutely agree 100% keepings it real. thanks storm-chaser appreciate your posts.

RobN
  • RobN
  • Advanced Member
26 January 2015 21:02:31


 


I think you should move in with Mike, it is hardly poor


Blimey


Originally Posted by: Gooner 


If only you had read and followed my whole sentence rather than focussing on one word.


Rob
In the flatlands of South Cambridgeshire 15m ASL.
David M Porter
26 January 2015 21:08:48


Sensible and realistic post, James. Your contributions to this thread are always a breath of fresh air 


Originally Posted by: Matty H 


Hear hear.


Lenzie, Glasgow

"Let us not take ourselves too seriously. None of us has a monopoly on wisdom, and we must always be ready to listen and respect other points of view."- Queen Elizabeth II 1926-2022
The Beast from the East
26 January 2015 21:12:44
I think the thundersnow event was on 28th Jan 2004. Ironically exactly the same day as Wednesday's cold front.

Short ECM ens
http://www.knmi.nl/exp/pluim/Data/PLUIM_06260_NWT.png

Control looks blocked aswell with a cold surface high. Bit of scatter though.
"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
The Beast from the East
26 January 2015 21:28:21
We also only had about an inch or two but it caused chaos on the roads as the initial rain washed away the grit and there was a rapid freeze overnight.
"We have some alternative facts for you"
Kelly-Ann Conway - special adviser to the President
Stormchaser
26 January 2015 21:42:39

Stormchaser , you are being very pessimistic for us Southerners. you may well be right but from what I read this cold spell for the south of England is hardly worth mentioning at al...l you quote 'very tame cold spell'. In other words nothing much temperature and precipitation wise for the South of UK, yet many other posters and indeed the Met Office seem to imply a rather different view. I do find it frustrating and confusing when there is such a difference in poster's views on this forum. So often the final result is somewhat different!

Originally Posted by: cultman1 


There will always be differences of opinion I'm afraid.


However I'm not sure where you get the impression that the Met Office are suggesting something more significant; they posted an update on FB and Twitter that implied a good chance of some snow showers in the south, but with amounts expected to be too low for accumulations.


Their official forecast speaks only of 'blustery wintry showers' for Wednesday night in the south, these focused across the west.


If you have seen something from them that implies otherwise, be sure to post a link so that we can all enjoy it 


 


Believe me, I really want to be able to predict some decent snowfall and accumulations on the ground, but at this stage I have little evidence to support such claims - just a small chance that the models and Met Office are underestimating the precipitation rates.


Some five or six years ago, I was guilty of getting carried away on many occasions, and while on a few occasions it came through, there were enough cases of stressful radar watching and last minute letdowns to hammer home the fact that having low expectations generally allows for a more relaxed existence.


Worth bearing in mind though that I live in a location so poor for snow that even in the coldest week of December 2010 I saw a bit of rain turning my 2-3 inches of level snow into a far less appealing layer of rough ice... so I am bound to be among the most skeptical of us all - it's a force of habit.


If you have any problems or queries relating to TWO you can Email [email protected]

https://twitter.com/peacockreports 
2023's Homeland Extremes:
T-Max: 30.2°C 9th Sep (...!) | T-Min: -7.1°C 22nd & 23rd Jan | Wettest Day: 25.9mm 2nd Nov | Ice Days: 1 (2nd Dec -1.3°C in freezing fog)
Keep Calm and Forecast On
Saint Snow
26 January 2015 22:05:15

I'm hoping Quantum does one of his patented snow risk maps soon




Martin
Home: St Helens (26m asl) Work: Manchester (75m asl)
A TWO addict since 14/12/01
"How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? Here lies the whole art of Conservative politics."
Aneurin Bevan
Patrick01
26 January 2015 22:26:36

I'll have that 18Z thanks! Doesn't look in as stable a position to stave off the Atlantic long term at this point but the wind direction would do nicely for early next week. Shame it's a week away. 

Rob K
26 January 2015 22:28:23
http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rtavn1743.gif 
Yateley, NE Hampshire, 73m asl
"But who wants to be foretold the weather? It is bad enough when it comes, without our having the misery of knowing about it beforehand." — Jerome K. Jerome
Gooner
26 January 2015 22:34:50

Modele UKMO - Carte FAX Bracknell - Pression et fronts


Latest fax chart shows fronts moving South


Remember anything after T120 is really Just For Fun



Marcus
Banbury
North Oxfordshire
378 feet A S L


sizzle
26 January 2015 22:37:29


Modele UKMO - Carte FAX Bracknell - Pression et fronts


Latest fax chart shows fronts moving South


Originally Posted by: Gooner 

and turning to rain as it moves thru maybe sleet if lucky. . tho could be worse new York is in for 90cm of snow

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